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  1. 31 Dec '06 14:35
    How would you react if a player asked you in a tournament to resign if the game could go either way but if the player won he would progress through. If it was a draw or loss then both players would lose out and someone else would get through.

    I guess it comes down to would you sacrifice yourself to let another player win instead of a different player.

    I don't think this breaks any rules but feel free to correct me if it does.

    Is it unfair? Would you do it? Or try extra hard to win to smite them?
  2. 31 Dec '06 14:42 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Will Everitt
    How would you react if a player asked you in a tournament to resign if the game could go either way but if the player won he would progress through. If it was a draw or loss then both players would lose out and someone else would get through.

    I guess it comes down to would you sacrifice yourself to let another player win instead of a different player orrect me if it does.

    Is it unfair? Would you do it? Or try extra hard to win to smite them?
    Someone correct me please if I am wrong but I believe this is against the rules. But if asked I would ask him how he would feel if he was the player who would loss out to such an underhand deal, and point out thats why he has to win it on merit, otherwise it devalues the tournament win if he did go on to win the tournament.
  3. 31 Dec '06 14:50
    Originally posted by stevetodd
    Someone correct me please if I am wrong but I believe this is against the rules. But if asked I would ask him how he would feel if he was the player who would loss out to such an underhand deal, and point out thats why he has to win it on merit, otherwise it devalues the tournament win if he did go on to win the tournament.
    I don't know what rule this breaks. Can't remember one that applys to it.

    Also same question as before but what if the player asked you for a draw as that would be enough for them to progress? Would this be ok? Or still out of order?
  4. 31 Dec '06 16:58
    I wouldn't care. I go for a win, anyway.

    In a duel kind of tournament it suffices for me to have one win to progess, my opponent does also progress if I lose the the other game. Should I lose just to be kind to him? No way.

    A game is made to be faught. Can you win, then win, no matter the consequences for the others in the same group.
  5. Standard member Dragon Fire
    Lord of all beasts
    31 Dec '06 16:58
    Originally posted by Will Everitt
    I don't know what rule this breaks. Can't remember one that applys to it.

    Also same question as before but what if the player asked you for a draw as that would be enough for them to progress? Would this be ok? Or still out of order?
    I cannot see what is against the rules and if a player offered a draw that is reasonable and fair. You either accept or reject, but for a player to ask for you to resign in an equal position (so he can go through) seems unreasonable and I would not do this.

    I, myself, have occasionally offered early draws to another player (of similar rating to me) early in a tournament which if we then won the other games would put us both through but this isn't for underhand reasons but rather to reduce my game load for legitimate reasons. Such a tactic could backfire of course and knock us both out.

    Also when I stand better in one game and my opponent in the other I may offer to resign one if he resigns the other. This may be a result that puts us both through but is not underhand in my opinion.

    The situation you describe seems different and I would never concede an equal or better game to enable one person to progress at the expense of another in a tournament. Play on and beat him as he does not deserve to go through. Although perhaps reconsider if he sends you US$100.
  6. Subscriber Very Rusty
    Treat Everyone Equal
    04 Jan '07 06:29
    LOL....Money talks huh 🙂
  7. Standard member rcihof
    Come on, chemicals!
    04 Jan '07 06:44
    Originally posted by Will Everitt
    I guess it comes down to would you sacrifice yourself to let another player win instead of a different player.
    Well, I don't see how this is fair to the third party, then - maybe that person deserves to continue anyway? And if both of them are sneaky enough to ask for you to throw the match (or take a dive in the 12th round, however you want to see it), how then would you decide? Play to win whenever you can, and if you lose, just lose fair and square and feel good about it.
  8. Standard member knightwest
    General of GROSS
    04 Jan '07 14:14
    It all seems a bit like match fixing to me. I never resign (asked or not), always go for the win.

    This kind of situation sometimes occurs in FIFA World Cup group stages, when a team has to win it's 3rd match against a team that's already knocked out. It is the duty of the team that's been knocked out to play as well as they can as the result of this match can affect the the outcome of the group.

    Basically, if the result of a game in a tournament can affect more than just that one game it is unsporting to forfeit, resign, or even to not go all out.
  9. Standard member buffalobill
    Major Bone
    16 Jan '07 06:18
    Originally posted by knightwest

    Basically, if the result of a game in a tournament can affect more than just that one game it is unsporting to forfeit, resign, or even to not go all out.
    Unfair, yes, but not cheating if the rules don't cover it. Personally, I'd tell him to take a hike.
    This of course is the sort of thing Fischer railed against. The Russians would agree nice easy draws between themselves so they were rested for the games against him. He was right.
  10. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    16 Jan '07 09:00
    Originally posted by Will Everitt
    How would you react if a player asked you in a tournament to resign if the game could go either way but if the player won he would progress through. If it was a draw or loss then both players would lose out and someone else would get through.

    I guess it comes down to would you sacrifice yourself to let another player win instead of a different player ...[text shortened]... orrect me if it does.

    Is it unfair? Would you do it? Or try extra hard to win to smite them?
    What would I say? I'd say that I'm not allowing a non-sub to progress in a tournament if I can help it.
  11. Standard member skeeter
    515 + 30 days
    16 Jan '07 10:21
    Originally posted by XanthosNZ
    What would I say? I'd say that I'm not allowing a non-sub to progress in a tournament if I can help it.
    Well, what ever you say Trev, no one gives a rats pitoote anymore. What's more Trev, there's sod all you can do about it.
    So, just leave the platform. No train coming for you today.

    skeeter
  12. Subscriber invigorate
    Only 1 F in Uckfield
    16 Jan '07 10:49
    Originally posted by Will Everitt
    How would you react if a player asked you in a tournament to resign if the game could go either way but if the player won he would progress through. If it was a draw or loss then both players would lose out and someone else would get through.

    I guess it comes down to would you sacrifice yourself to let another player win instead of a different player ...[text shortened]... orrect me if it does.

    Is it unfair? Would you do it? Or try extra hard to win to smite them?
    Was I morally wrong in this game:

    Game 2776158

    Both My Opponent and I would progress with a win but a draw would mean we were both both eliminated.

    My opponent offered a draw.
    I said whilst I woud normally accept a draw in this situation a draw was pointless in context of the tournie, so I'd rather slog on in the hope of my opponent making an error.
    Thus he resigned rather than be bored to tears.

    I progressed - but somehow it feels wrong.
  13. 16 Jan '07 13:23
    Originally posted by invigorate
    I progressed - but somehow it feels wrong.
    Its never wrong to advance 🙂
  14. 16 Jan '07 14:40
    Originally posted by invigorate
    I progressed - but somehow it feels wrong.
    I don't see anything particularly wrong with that. I've played on longer in matches where I needed a win where I'd usually take the draw. Though in that case I probably wouldn't wait too long.

    As long as you don't object to them drawing it out as long as possible before taking the draw by the 50 move rule about 6 months later, which they are also completely entitled to do 🙂
  15. Standard member DeepThought
    Losing the Thread
    16 Jan '07 19:43
    Originally posted by Will Everitt
    How would you react if a player asked you in a tournament to resign if the game could go either way but if the player won he would progress through. If it was a draw or loss then both players would lose out and someone else would get through.

    I guess it comes down to would you sacrifice yourself to let another player win instead of a different player ...[text shortened]... orrect me if it does.

    Is it unfair? Would you do it? Or try extra hard to win to smite them?
    I took a look at the rules in the FIDE website. Apart from 12.1 about players not bringing the game into disrepute there isn't anything, and in the FIDE tournament rules there is a prohibition on the result being pre-arranged. ICCF doesn't say anything.

    If a draw means you progress, then all you have to do is offer the draw, your opponent knows the score anyway. If you need a win then I don't think you can reasonably ask your opponent to resign a non-lost game, even if they can't go through. I'd play on in the game you're referring to.