Originally posted by @ragwortRubbish
That's like blaming the ref for giving a penalty. The challenge was lost by those players, me included, who did not play well enough and lost our games.
You lost those points due to an incorrect scoring system
You may have lost the match due to a penalty but you wouldn't have lost points that you had already gained in other matches
Originally posted by @padgerI wonder if you are muddling two issues?
Rubbish
You lost those points due to an incorrect scoring system
You may have lost the match due to a penalty but you wouldn't have lost points that you had already gained in other matches
One is whether a scoring system should reflect if a challenge was edged or dominated by the winning clan. As it is Russ has set it so that larger challenges come with greater risk. In some respects why should a clan leader tie up 7 or 8 players in a challenge that may only be worth 1 point if the challenge is edged.
The second is how you deal with games that in effect don't start and exploitation thereof. In serious official correspondence tournaments elsewhere on the net games are anulled if they have not progressed far enough to be adjudicated. Given that you can't tell the motive behind an early resignation or timeout Russ has done what he can to dissuade players throwing clan games at an early stage by removing them from the mix. I dont think that is unreasonable comparing to what happens elsewhere.
At the end of the day once you total up the games that have been allowed by the system you still have to blame losses on the losers. If you want to change the scoring system to reflect edged challenges that's different but in my view, potentially flawed.
Originally posted by @padgerLook at RHP like a casino.
Rubbish
You lost those points due to an incorrect scoring system
You may have lost the match due to a penalty but you wouldn't have lost points that you had already gained in other matches
In order to win you have to take a risk.
You have to gamble your hard earned points in order to win more
Russ even offers credit as clans can have minus points but are still able to gamble
Imagine playing roulette where you got all winnings but did not lose. That's what we had before and it made it non competitive as the large clans played more
Now they have to risk points to get more.
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Originally posted by @roma45Nice illustration!
Look at RHP like a casino.
In order to win you have to take a risk.
You have to gamble your hard earned points in order to win more
Russ even offers credit as clans can have minus points but are still able to gamble
Imagine playing roulette where you got all winnings but did not lose. That's what we had before and it made it non competitive as the large clans played more
Now they have to risk points to get more.
Originally posted by @roma45There are people who told me the clan challenge system is like a football match and I can see that
Look at RHP like a casino.
In order to win you have to take a risk.
You have to gamble your hard earned points in order to win more
Russ even offers credit as clans can have minus points but are still able to gamble
Imagine playing roulette where you got all winnings but did not lose. That's what we had before and it made it non competitive as the large clans played more
Now they have to risk points to get more.
The challenge is like a game of football and each game is like goals scored
So I can understand when my goal difference changes but I am unable to grasp why if I won against another clan this can be taken away when I lose to another team, who had nothing to do with the first challenge
Now they say no its like going to a casino
You have to gamble
If the latter is true then this will be the end of the large clan and also the large challenge
This is why Charming Billy Is second this year
He cuts his chances of getting minus points to almost nothing and I can see him running away with the whole thing next year
Originally posted by @padgerIt's net challenge points - the difference between points won and points lost over the season. Not, as some have tried to argue, the difference between the game points in each individual challenge. Just like net value is the total of assets minus liabilities etc etc.
There are people who told me the clan challenge system is like a football match and I can see that
The challenge is like a game of football and each game is like goals scored
So I can understand when my goal difference changes but I am unable to grasp why if I won against another clan this can be taken away when I lose to another team, who had nothing to d ...[text shortened]... ing minus points to almost nothing and I can see him running away with the whole thing next year
Originally posted by @roma45An eloquent analogy my friend. You are a man of hidden talents.
Look at RHP like a casino.
In order to win you have to take a risk.
You have to gamble your hard earned points in order to win more
Russ even offers credit as clans can have minus points but are still able to gamble
Imagine playing roulette where you got all winnings but did not lose. That's what we had before and it made it non competitive as the large clans played more
Now they have to risk points to get more.
I think the next thing that needs to be addressed is the awarding of points for drawn challenges. Currently points are given to both teams in the event of a draw. An example is say a 5 member on each clan (10 games) draws 5 all. Each clan receives 5 points each. This does not nullify points as a win loss situation does (winner 10 points, loser negative 10 points resulting in a balance of zero 10-10=0).
Drwan challenges need to result in 0 points for both teams. Hope you guys get what I mean (except Padger who has absolutely no idea). This will stop clans such as Lemondrops playing for draws or colluding for draws.
This is the only game with a league type system I have ever been involved with that works like this
Not in football,american football,baseball,cricket,rugby,snooker,pool,darts,does a result in one game affect a result in another game
Its like St Johnston going to Celtic and getting a 1 - 0 win and the next week going to Hearts and losing 2 - 0 and that would mean that you actually only got a draw against Celtic
It is not ( in the words of Spock ) logical and so therefor not fair
Originally posted by @padgerAnd how many of these sports involve teams of different numbers who can play as many or few challenges in a year as they please.
This is the only game with a league type system I have ever been involved with that works like this
Not in football,american football,baseball,cricket,rugby,snooker,pool,darts,does a result in one game affect a result in another game
Its like St Johnston going to Celtic and getting a 1 - 0 win and the next week going to Hearts and losing 2 - 0 and that wou ...[text shortened]... got a draw against Celtic
It is not ( in the words of Spock ) logical and so therefor not fair
You're not grasping the complexity of the structure of the clans system and trying to equate it to some fully structural system that plays with even players and an even amount of challenges each year.
Why don't you concentrate on the clan leagues that are set up the way you want and give us all a rest from your continuous whining.
Originally posted by @padgerSt johnstone going to Celtic and winning..... behave we are in a terrible run.
This is the only game with a league type system I have ever been involved with that works like this
Not in football,american football,baseball,cricket,rugby,snooker,pool,darts,does a result in one game affect a result in another game
Its like St Johnston going to Celtic and getting a 1 - 0 win and the next week going to Hearts and losing 2 - 0 and that wou ...[text shortened]... got a draw against Celtic
It is not ( in the words of Spock ) logical and so therefor not fair
Can't compare football to the clan challenge. If you did we could challenge other teams for a 20 points match play more games than anyone and win the league.
Time outs should not be counted
Drawn challenges should count as zero points.
The main thing I wanted was a separate clan from normal rating it happens in clubs. But Russ has said it would be impossible to do.
Originally posted by @radioactive69The reason I am not grasping the complexity of the clan system is that it is complete nonsense
And how many of these sports involve teams of different numbers who can play as many or few challenges in a year as they please.
You're not grasping the complexity of the structure of the clans system and trying to equate it to some fully structural system that plays with even players and an even amount of challenges each year.
Why don't you con ...[text shortened]... an leagues that are set up the way you want and give us all a rest from your continuous whining.
I get it that we are playing different amounts of games with different amounts of players
What I don't get is how one challenge affects the outcome of another challenge
Both results should stand on their own
Originally posted by @padgerZZZ-Zzzz-ZZzzz-hngGGggh-Ppbhww- zZZzzzZZ.......mimimimimimimim (3 stooges)
The reason I am not grasping the complexity of the clan system is that it is complete nonsense
I get it that we are playing different amounts of games with different amounts of players
What I don't get is how one challenge affects the outcome of another challenge
Both results should stand on their own
(Someone wake me if he changes the tune) ...ZZZ-Zzzz-ZZzzz-hngGGggh-Ppbhww- zZZzzzZZ.......mimimimimimimi