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Debates Forum

  1. Standard member bill718
    Enigma
    15 Oct '10 10:54
    A lot of anger floating around here regarding our economy today.

    Republicans are blaming the Democrats for too much deficit spending, resulting in a huge national debt, which may be adding to the problem, rather than fixing it.

    Democrats are blaming Republicans for not regulating banks and other financial institutions, resulting in too many unwise loans to unqualified people which was the cause of this financial mess to begin with.

    The fact is...they are both right. This economy will slowly improve because There will be less deficit spending, because the newly elected GOP lawmakers will insist on it, and there will be new regulations in place regarding what lenders are allowed to do, because Democrats will have there financial reform rules in place.

    Expecting the American economy to bounce back like a rubber ball from the crash of 2008 is unrealistic. Things are improving folks, but it will take time, so tone down the anger, stop blaming the other side (who ever they are), and understand the you can't fix complex problems with political soundbites.

  2. 15 Oct '10 13:01 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by bill718
    A lot of anger floating around here regarding our economy today.

    Republicans are blaming the Democrats for too much deficit spending, resulting in a huge national debt, which may be adding to the problem, rather than fixing it.

    Democrats are blaming Republicans for not regulating banks and other financial institutions, resulting in too many unwise loan ...[text shortened]... r they are), and understand the you can't fix complex problems with political soundbites.

    This seems to be the GOP's whole strategy. Actually a pretty good strategy. Regardless of whatever action is taken - or even if no action is taken, the economy will likely recover significantly by 2012 -- and the GOP will then take all the credit for using their gains in the 2010 elections to obstruct all of Obama's agenda. They will proclaim that their efforts ended the "Obama recession" as they march into the White House.

    But the great unknown is how the Tea Party grassroots will react once they realize that no real effort is being made by so-called "Tea Party candidates" to reform Washington. Or how the rest of the nation (or even the GOP itself) will react if those Tea Party candidates actually DO try to carry out radical changes.
  3. Standard member KellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    15 Oct '10 13:08
    Originally posted by bill718
    A lot of anger floating around here regarding our economy today.

    Republicans are blaming the Democrats for too much deficit spending, resulting in a huge national debt, which may be adding to the problem, rather than fixing it.

    Democrats are blaming Republicans for not regulating banks and other financial institutions, resulting in too many unwise loan ...[text shortened]... r they are), and understand the you can't fix complex problems with political soundbites.

    Actually I don't believe I'll go along with that you are saying, I'm very unhappy
    with the spend then tax group we have in power now and I'm voting them out!
    Kelly
  4. 15 Oct '10 16:49
    Originally posted by bill718
    A lot of anger floating around here regarding our economy today.

    Republicans are blaming the Democrats for too much deficit spending, resulting in a huge national debt, which may be adding to the problem, rather than fixing it.

    Democrats are blaming Republicans for not regulating banks and other financial institutions, resulting in too many unwise loan ...[text shortened]... r they are), and understand the you can't fix complex problems with political soundbites.

    mortgage deregulation was a Clinton thing according to some article i read the other day.

    altho, Clinton had a Republic congress for his last term. and Bush had a Democratic congress for his.

    and the Dems were heavily implicated in the Friends of Angelo thing.

    it's all mixed up. you can't trust any of them.
  5. 15 Oct '10 16:49
    Originally posted by Melanerpes
    This seems to be the GOP's whole strategy. Actually a pretty good strategy. Regardless of whatever action is taken - or even if no action is taken, the economy will likely recover significantly by 2012 -- and the GOP will then take all the credit for using their gains in the 2010 elections to obstruct all of Obama's agenda. They will proclaim that their e ...[text shortened]... lf) will react if those Tea Party candidates actually DO try to carry out radical changes.
    wut

    i thot telerion said the economy would recover significantly by 2010
  6. 15 Oct '10 17:45 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by bill718
    A lot of anger floating around here regarding our economy today.

    Republicans are blaming the Democrats for too much deficit spending, resulting in a huge national debt, which may be adding to the problem, rather than fixing it.

    Democrats are blaming Republicans for not regulating banks and other financial institutions, resulting in too many unwise loan ...[text shortened]... r they are), and understand the you can't fix complex problems with political soundbites.

    Tone down the anger? You must have a job.

    Of course, you forgot to include the rising taxes due to Congress not renewing the tax cuts as well as the burden on businesses regarding Obamacare to add more reasons why the economy dead. All they need to do is pass cap and trade and finish off all remaining components of capitalism.

    Really these are just birth pains for the new entitlement state being born. No longer do we need jobs.
  7. Standard member uzless
    The So Fist
    15 Oct '10 18:00
    verbal diarrhea all over this thread
  8. Standard member bill718
    Enigma
    15 Oct '10 18:50
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    Actually I don't believe I'll go along with that you are saying, I'm very unhappy
    with the spend then tax group we have in power now and I'm voting them out!
    Kelly
    You can vote any way you wish. I think you'll find however, this will not change things much. The economy was damaged badly in 2008. Financial reform was necessary, as was some stimulus from the Frderal Government. The Democrats may have gone too far with the spending, but the economy will be slow to heal, no matter who is in office.
  9. 15 Oct '10 19:11
    Ah yes, Bush damaged the economy in 2008... that wouldn't have happened if anyone else (such as Kerry or Gore) were in office instead.

    But with Obama, who (as an economic expert) told us that unemployment wouldn't exceed 8% if he got his agenda passed... it's now over 9.5% for a record (since they've been tracking it monthly beginning in 1948) 14 consecutive months. But when it comes to things that Obama is causing, well, that would have happened no matter who was in office.
  10. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    15 Oct '10 19:13 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by TheBloop
    Ah yes, Bush damaged the economy in 2008... that wouldn't have happened if anyone else (such as Kerry or Gore) were in office instead.

    But with Obama, who (as an economic expert) told us that unemployment wouldn't exceed 8% if he got his agenda passed... it's now over 9.5% for a record (since they've been tracking it monthly beginning in 1948) 14 consec ...[text shortened]... to things that Obama is causing, well, that would have happened no matter who was in office.
    I'm curious; what did Obama do that caused unemployment?
  11. Standard member bill718
    Enigma
    15 Oct '10 21:44
    Originally posted by whodey
    Tone down the anger? You must have a job.

    Of course, you forgot to include the rising taxes due to Congress not renewing the tax cuts as well as the burden on businesses regarding Obamacare to add more reasons why the economy dead. All they need to do is pass cap and trade and finish off all remaining components of capitalism.

    Really these are just birth pains for the new entitlement state being born. No longer do we need jobs.
    I must have a job? I have news for you skippy, I've been a Real Estate broker for over 20 years. Running a business in this economy is a challange, it means 50-60 hour work weeks, keeping my assistant employed, as well as listening to everyone (including you) whine about the economy. Pointing fingers at whoever sits in the Whitehouse is not the answer. The economy will improve, but it will be a slow process. In the meantime, stop bitching about the decline of capitalism, and realize the G O P and there deregulation mania was partly responsible for this mess to begin with.
  12. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    16 Oct '10 15:40
    Originally posted by whodey
    Tone down the anger? You must have a job.
    Hmm. Sounds like you're a socialist with your getting angry because nobody's giving you a job. Go out and earn one! Free markey laissez-faire! The rich are trustworthy guardians of the nation's wealth and it's perfectly reasonable for you to have to beg them for a job.

    Isn't that the free market right winger philosophy? Nobody owes you a job?
  13. 16 Oct '10 16:48
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    I'm curious; what did Obama do that caused unemployment?
    Maintain useless wars abroad, wasting money in the midst of a crisis while poor government finances hurt business and consumer confidence.
  14. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    16 Oct '10 16:54
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    Maintain useless wars abroad, wasting money in the midst of a crisis while poor government finances hurt business and consumer confidence.
    1) It's unclear to me how wars CAUSE unemployment. Generally the reverse is true;

    2) Some evidence that it was "poor government finances" rather than the overall state of the economy that "hurt" business and consumer confidence would be nice.
  15. 23 Oct '10 15:12
    Originally posted by bill718
    A lot of anger floating around here regarding our economy today.

    Republicans are blaming the Democrats for too much deficit spending, resulting in a huge national debt, which may be adding to the problem, rather than fixing it.

    Democrats are blaming Republicans for not regulating banks and other financial institutions, resulting in too many unwise loan ...[text shortened]... r they are), and understand the you can't fix complex problems with political soundbites.

    Less deficit spending would make the economy get worse, not better. We need stimulus spending to fix this economic crisis. It doesn't have to be -deficit- spending, though -- the budget can be balanced through increasing taxes on the rich and corporations, without compromising economic recovery.

    If the Republicans gain seats in Congress and then the economy improves, it will be due to the stimulus package having been good enough to prevent a worse crisis and give the economy space to heal. If Democrats gained seats and were able to spend more on jobs, the economy would improve even faster, just as it did in the four years that FDR reduced unemployment from 25% to (IIRC) 14.3%.

    Many structural indications are already improving, but unemployment remains a lagging indicator. Initial jobless claims are still elevated but may come down further in 2011. Unemployment is up and consumer spending is down, in a vicious cycle. If initial jobless claims decrease then it might lead to a positive cycle whereby employers and consumers regain some confidence as well. In this recession, hiring and consumer spending have remained low for longer than previous recessions where other structural indicators have improved.

    This may be in part due to consumers getting spooked back in May, and reducing spending, which employers responded to by reducing hiring just as it was starting to pick up again.