Ban on Underweight Models in Ads

Originally posted by quackquack
Why is it thin models in advertisements which cause anorexia but not thin people in movies or thin people in TV shows?

Have you actually looked at the top fashion houses model of choice, the only person I have seen on the telly that came close was Calista Flockhart(ally mcbeal) and she never could end the speculation regarding possible eating disorders.

I also remember the 'heroin look' of the nineties top models and there no evidence that the industry has changed its ways.

Originally posted by kevcvs57
No I am not more concerned about eating disorders than skin cancer but I think the link between the images of the perfect and 99% of the time unattainable body which the industry in question uses to sell its products is much more defined than the more diffuse link between swimwear and sun worshiper's.

The U.K sees an annual migration from our cloudy sho ...[text shortened]... oh wait, they probably appear in fashion magazines, having been produced by fashion designers.

You have given no evidence that models cause eating disorders. You have not even presented a theory as to why advertisements have more influence on self- image than the thin actors/ actresses in movies and TV.

I could conjecture that Hollywood glorifies drugs and alcohol; that NASCAR encourages speeding; that desert places encourage poor eating; that alcohol companies cause DWIs and liver disease. These are all more serious problems but the government does not see a need to change the content.

Originally posted by quackquack
You have given no evidence that models cause eating disorders. You have not even presented a theory as to why advertisements have more influence on self- image than the thin actors/ actresses in movies and TV.

I could conjecture that Hollywood glorifies drugs and alcohol; that NASCAR encourages speeding; that desert places encourage poor eating; tha ...[text shortened]... hese are all more serious problems but the government does not see a need to change the content.

So have you now moved from; whatever is going on it is not the govts business; to prove a link and I will agree with the interventionists? The only reason I ask is that its no fun trawling the web on 3g so it will only happen when I can get back to my laptop and broadband.

My concern is you seem to hold big business in such high regard and government in such low regard that I cannot inagine it will nake much difference.

My concern is you seem to hold big business in such high regard and government in such low regard that I cannot inagine it will nake much difference.[/b]

Is your argument that evidence does not to be given because you think that I might not be convinced by it?

If we want to discuss banning something such as underweight models in ads we should have some understanding as to why the activity is bad and why it is more damaging than some of the long lists of other things which may have negative externalities but are permitted everywhere. The information, that I believe is relevant, should show why ad models are more dangerous than other types of models/ actors/ actress who are chosen at least in part because of their thin physical appearance. I would also be interested in why less intrusive methods such as shutting off your TV or closing your magazine if you feel the advertisement is negatively effecting your mood.

Originally posted by FMF
"A new Israeli law bans showing overly thin models from local advertising in an attempt to fight the spread of eating disorders. It also requires publications to disclose when they use altered images of models to make the women and men appear even thinner than they really are. The law, passed late Monday, appears to be the first attempt by a government to use le ...[text shortened]... and bulimia, particularly among young women."

http://tinyurl.com/6mozlql

Ramifications?

Seems a little bit of a reach. It is striking, however, the 1 in 10 death rate for anorexics.

As for cause, generally while external imagery and their distorted self-image are definitely part of it, it anorexics are most about being overachievers attempting to assert control in their life where there are troubling issues they cannot control. And the age they develop anorexia is becoming younger.

Commonly, anorexia will develop in a transition period such as between elementary school and middle school, or between middle school and high school, or between high school and college. The younger they develop anorexia, the greater chance it can be successfully treated and they overcome it. In contrast, the older they develop it, the higher the death rate.

My daughter develop anorexia at age 11 and after nearly starving herself to death, was hospitalized for several weeks in Texas Children's Hospital in a physical restoration and rigid behavioral modification program. The hospital program allowed TV but not magazines.

Originally posted by moon1969
Seems a little bit of a reach. It is striking, however, the 1 in 10 death rate for anorexics.

As for cause, generally while imagery and their distorted self-image are definitely part of it, it anorexics are most about overachievers attempting to assert control in their life where there are troubling issues they cannot control.

My daughter develop a ...[text shortened]... ration and behavioral modification program. The hospital program allowed TV but not magazines.

I am certainly sorry to hear about your daughter.

Based on your information that experts in the field believe that magazine ads (as opposed to other information media) are major triggers in the development of anorexia, then I feel the ban is far more justified than I previously did.

Originally posted by quackquack
Based on your information that experts in the field believe that magazine ads (as opposed to other information media) are major triggers in the development of anorexia, then I feel the ban is far more justified than I previously did.

I think so, but I am on the fence about it. It is complicated. Yet, I did find it interesting that the hospital program banned magazines but not TV. Though, the program did somewhat monitor what was watched on TV and would frown if the skeleton kid was watching an exercise show on TV, for example.

When my daughter went into the program, she had grown a peach fuzz hair over here entire body which is supposedly a starving animal's way to try to help preserve calories. The hospital had cameras in the room to make sure the kid wasn't hiding their food instead of eating it, and to make sure the starved kid wasn't exercising. Most anorexics are compulsive exercisers and standers. My daughter would never sit, and would secretly try to walk in place. A big part of the program to keep the kid from dying was the immediate need for the kid to take in food and preserve calories so to give crucial weight gain. (Providing calories intravenously was a last resort).

My daughter never watched TV because she viewed watching TV as an unhealthy activity. But most of the other participants in the program watched alot of TV. It was really the main activity to do, unfortunately.

Lastly, I researched the doctors and they were leaders in the field with good credentials, and there was a team of 6 doctors per child in the program including a primary physician, nutritionist, counselor, and expert in eating disorders, etc. Though while I was supportive and deferential to the doctors, I didn't always agree with them. For instance, my daughter was like living in a prison and they wouldn't let me take her outside on a nice spring day for a few minutes, even though I would make sure there was no physical activity or vomiting or discarding food. I just wanted her to get five minutes of sun on her face on a nice weather day.

Originally posted by quackquack
Why is it thin models in advertisements which cause anorexia but not thin people in movies or thin people in TV shows?

Why is it you are lumping in ultra thin anorexia-chic fashion models with slim people in movies and TV shows?

The Houston Chronicle had an article today on this Israeli law. (Israel: Skinny models are just bad role models)

Israeli law eyes super-thin models as bad examples

JERUSALEM (AP) — Told she was too fat to be a model, Danielle Segal shed a quarter of her weight and was hospitalized twice for malnutrition. Now that a new Israeli law prohibits the employment of underweight models, the 19-year-old must gain some of it back if she wants to work again.

Not that she was ever overweight. At 1.7 meters (5-feet-7), she weighed 53 kilograms (116 pounds) to begin with. Feeling pressure to become ever thinner, she dropped another 13 kilograms (29 pounds). The unnaturally skeletal girl weighed 40 kilograms (88 pounds) by then, or about as much as a robust pre-teen, and her health suffered.

The legislation passed Monday aims to put a stop to the extremes, and by extension ease the pressure on youngsters to emulate the skin-and-bones models, often resulting in dangerous eating disorders. The new law poses a groundbreaking challenge to a fashion industry widely castigated for promoting anorexia and bulimia. Its sponsors say it could become an example for other countries grappling with the spread of the life-threatening disorders. It's especially important in Israel, which, like other countries, is obsessed by models, whose every utterance and dalliance is fodder for large pictures and racy stories in the nation's newspapers. Supermodel Bar Refaeli is considered a national hero by many. She is not unnaturally thin.

The new law requires models to produce a medical report no older than three months at every shoot for the Israeli market, stating that they are not malnourished by World Health Organization standards. . . . Also, any advertisement published for the Israeli market must have a clearly written notice disclosing if its models were made to look thinner by digital manipulation. The law does not apply to foreign publications sold in Israel.

In Israel, about 2 percent of girls between 14 and 18 have severe eating disorders, a rate similar to other developed countries, experts said.

The law's supporters hope it will encourage the use of healthy models in local advertising and heighten awareness of digital tricks that transform already skinny women into seeming waifs. "We want to break the illusion that the model we see is real," said Liad Gil-Har, assistant to law sponsor Dr. Rachel Adato, who compared the battle against eating disorders to the struggle against smoking. The law won support from a surprising quarter: one of Israel's top model agents, Adi Barkan, who said in 30 years of work, he has seen young women become skinnier and sicker while struggling to fit the shrinking mold of what the industry considers attractive.

"They look like dead girls," Barkan said.

Aspiring model Segal says she's thrilled with the new law and wishes it had been passed years ago. "I wouldn't have grown up thinking that this (being underweight) is a model of beauty. I wouldn't have reached the point I reached," she said. Segal said an agent told her three years ago that she had a beautiful face — but not a "model's body." Trying to attain that ideal through drastic diets, she ended up in the hospital twice and stopped menstruating.

. . . Barkan estimated about half the 300 professional models in Israel would have to gain weight to work again.

Critics say the legislation should have focused on health, not weight, arguing that many models are naturally thin.

Unrealistic body images in the media are believed to shape eating habits, especially among young people, though there is debate about how influential they are. Other factors include psychological health, trauma like sexual assault, or a tendency within one's family to emphasize physical appearance as a sign of success.

http://www.chron.com/news/article/Israeli-law-eyes-super-thin-models-as-bad-examples-3419525.php

Originally posted by quackquack
It is dissatisying to me when the government picks on one group the fashion industry when their product is no more damaging than many of the others listed and the damage is far less direct.

I on the other hand think government should tackle all those problems, and not ignore one just because you think it is ignoring others.

Originally posted by badmoon
FMF, it seems that you so rarely offer opinions, but rather solicit and question them.

I wonder if you've read far too much Plato.

To your thread, its way too much government interference.

“...its way too much government interference. ...”

I am curious to know exactly what criteria you use to define “too much” government interference
as well as the criteria you use to distinguish government “interference” from justified or needed government “help”?

Originally posted by FMF
Why is it you are lumping in ultra thin anorexia-chic fashion models with slim people in movies and TV shows?

Because it seems that aorexics don't differentiate -- they worship the thinness and develop eating disorders trying to reach something that is unattainable. The reality is at a certain point loss of weight is certainly unhealthy and in most peoples minds subjective unattractive yet they still push themselves to reach a thinner ideal.

Originally posted by quackquack
The reality is at a certain point loss of weight is certainly unhealthy and in most peoples minds subjective unattractive yet they still push themselves to reach a thinner ideal.

Seems to me that this "certain point" you mention [that is "certainly unhealthy" as you put it] is reached by the fashion industry considerably more often than other media outlets.

Originally posted by FMF
Seems to me that this "certain point" you mention [that is "certainly unhealthy" as you put it] is reached by the fashion industry considerably more often than other media outlets.

It is my belief that we are not passing the law because we think glorifying anorexic models makes people want to be anorexic. We are passing the law because the thin "ideal" which is developed from more than just seeing anorexic models (it is from seeing all sorts of thin people everywhere) forces people to develop eating disorders in a desperate attempt to be thinner.

Originally posted by quackquack
It is my belief that we are not passing the law because we think glorifying anorexic models makes people want to be anorexic. We are passing the law because the thin "ideal" which is developed from more than just seeing anorexic models (it is from seeing all sorts of thin people everywhere) forces people to develop eating disorders in a desperate attempt to be thinner.

Shakira, Beyonce, Kim Kardashian, J Lo. Personally, I find these big-bootied women MUCH more attractive than stick-figure heroin addicts!

What is puzzling is why a young girl would come to the opposite conclusion.