Originally posted by NargagunaChrist, it is like talking to a 3-year old.....
Can't you answer my question? In which communist society has the competition you dream of actually existed ?
Read the posts - it is a discussion about the future, not the past.
Nobody is claiming this has already happened, we're discussing what might happen.
I know you always view things in terms of the past, but, surprisingly enough, some of us look to the future.
Originally posted by RedmikeI may say that during my dealings with the NCB I also encountered a good many belligerent socialists like you, and it was ofcourse the most famous of that ilk who played the biggest part in destroying the industry.
Christ, it is like talking to a 3-year old.....
Read the posts - it is a discussion about the future, not the past.
Nobody is claiming this has already happened, we're discussing what might happen.
I know you always view things in terms of the past, but, surprisingly enough, some of us look to the future.
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Originally posted by NargagunaYeah - Blah Blah.
I may say that during my dealings with the NCB I also encountered a good many belligerent socialists like you, and it was ofcourse the most famous of that ilk who played the biggest part in destroying the industry.
Irrelevant drivel.
PS Ian McGregor was a socialist?
Originally posted by Vladamir no1Let me get this straight. You run around yelling, "Ban Capitalism! Ban the Olympics! Ban the World Cup!", and then accuse me of lacking sophistication??! 🙄😴🙄😴🙄😴
But I'm not entertained by your lack of sophistication! I feel sorry for you...
Football and the Olympics are a celebration of capitalism
Originally posted by RedmikePlease explain on how two factories producing the same thing, paying the same to each worker and selling it at the same price would compete?
And there's nothing wrong with economic competition either- there's no reason why 2 factories which produce the same thing, owned by the workers, can't compete with each other in terms of efficiency or whatever.
So long as this isn't a factor in the 'pay' of these workers, or the 'price' of what they produce, I don't have a problem with this.
Cost-productivity? What happens to difference in profits then? Redistributed? Talk about a free-riding problem.
Originally posted by PalynkaFirstly, there are no profits - that is a mechanism peculiar to the current economic system.
Please explain on how two factories producing the same thing, paying the same to each worker and selling it at the same price would compete?
Cost-productivity? What happens to difference in profits then? Redistributed? Talk about a free-riding problem.
The competition could take many forms - just coming up with more 'productive' ways of doing things, for example.
They're not competing in the capitalist sense - driving down costs to get the cheapest price and all that jazz, but competing as a means of improving the production process.
Originally posted by RedmikeThere is no competition then, now is there? If a factory comes up with a more "productive way" of doing things, wouldn't it share it with the other factories?
Firstly, there are no profits - that is a mechanism peculiar to the current economic system.
The competition could take many forms - just coming up with more 'productive' ways of doing things, for example.
They're not competing in the capitalist sense - driving down costs to get the cheapest price and all that jazz, but competing as a means of improving the production process.
All I see is a faint, altruistic incentive to increase productivity and strong, practical incentives to decrease it. In the end, productivity stagnates.
Another question: How would you fix prices? Or would you abolish money and private property?
Originally posted by PalynkaYes, if Factory A came up with a better way of doing things, they would share it with factory B. Factory A would still have 'won' that 'competition' though.
There is no competition then, now is there? If a factory comes up with a more "productive way" of doing things, wouldn't it share it with the other factories?
All I see is a faint, altruistic incentive to increase productivity and strong, practical incentives to decrease it. In the end, productivity stagnates.
Another question: How would you fix prices? Or would you abolish money and private property?
Re your other question, I guess it would depend on what stage you're at. Ultimately, there would be no money, and the need for private property would be replaced by communal property in time.
Originally posted by shavixmirSporting competitivness is a capitalist rhetoric as the foci is on competition and winning, the survival of the fittest. Also football is mostly about money making, again a capitalist ideology.
There's nothing un-communist about competitivness in general.
It's when the producing classes are undermined by it, that it becomes a problem.
So basically you have to make a distinction between economic competetivness and sporting competitivness.
I'm starting to think that people on this thread think that I'm a communist or a socialist, but I'm not , we all know that they don't work.
I'm not entirely against capitalism until there is a better solution which at the moment there isn't, but......... we can improve cappitalism as it stands, ie We need to address the class system and how its kept in place through different levels of education, one for the working class another for the middle class and yet another for the upper class. Also the whole 9 to 5 ethos is so ingrained that people see it as normal and natural, when infact the average 'forager' works approximately 15 hours a week.
We are crushed in one way or another by the wheels of capitalism and we need to address this, just ask any developing country !!!!
Originally posted by Vladamir no1We are operating in a capitalist economy, that is why football is about making money.
Sporting competitivness is a capitalist rhetoric as the foci is on competition and winning, the survival of the fittest. Also football is mostly about money making, again a capitalist ideology.
I'm starting to think that people on this thread think that I'm a communist or a socialist, but I'm not , we all know that they don't work.
I'm not entirely ...[text shortened]... e wheels of capitalism and we need to address this, just ask any developing country !!!!
In a capitalist economy, that is what everything is about.
So, the problem is with the economic system, not with football.
Lets get rid of capitalism, but keep football!
Originally posted by RedmikeYour love of football is outshining your political leanings...
We are operating in a capitalist economy, that is why football is about making money.
In a capitalist economy, that is what everything is about.
So, the problem is with the economic system, not with football.
Lets get rid of capitalism, but keep football!
We need to get rid of the competitve spirit, you should only compete with yourself not others...
Originally posted by Vladamir no1I am a simple soul. For me, I don't think it matters one bit what the social,economic or political system is as long as the people who live in it are not greedy.
Sporting competitivness is a capitalist rhetoric as the foci is on competition and winning, the survival of the fittest. Also football is mostly about money making, again a capitalist ideology.
I'm starting to think that people on this thread think that I'm a communist or a socialist, but I'm not , we all know that they don't work.
I'm not entirely ...[text shortened]... e wheels of capitalism and we need to address this, just ask any developing country !!!!
for me, there is an excitement about running your own business, in a capitalist environment that I'd miss in Redmikes' world. However, I have no idea what the point of increasing your profits each year, increasing your personal income every few months and getting more and more money actually is!
Originally posted by Vladamir no1There's no reason why you can't play to win and feel pretty good with your own skills having achieving the win, it's only a problem if you need that win to validate yourself.
Your love of football is outshining your political leanings...
We need to get rid of the competitve spirit, you should only compete with yourself not others...