Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    05 Sep '18 10:44
    The real wages for American workers are continuing to decline. Yes, the CEOs of major corporations saw a 54 percent increase in their compensation. Yes, the stock market is hitting off the wall. Yes, the rich are getting richer. But what about the average worker. Well the front pages of corporate America’s newspapers don’t talk about it. But for the average American worker, despite all the so-called boom, the real wages are going down. People continue to work long hours for low wages…



    If our workers are forced to compete against desperate people in Mexico or in China who are trying to get by on starvation wages. If we merge these economies, what is the ultimate result?


    https://www.breitbart.com/sports/2018/09/04/flashback-nike-blasted-by-bernie-sanders-in-1997-for-outsourcing-jobs-to-sweatshops-in-vietnam/

    Do you think that we should do more to protect the American workers, and not send our jobs over to desperate people who won't even truly benefit?
  2. Joined
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    05 Sep '18 15:14
    Originally posted by @philokalia
    [quote]The real wages for American workers are continuing to decline. Yes, the CEOs of major corporations saw a 54 percent increase in their compensation. Yes, the stock market is hitting off the wall. Yes, the rich are getting richer. But what about the average worker. Well the front pages of corporate America’s newspapers don’t talk about it. But for t ...[text shortened]... e American workers, and not send our jobs over to desperate people who won't even truly benefit?
    Foreigners are also brought into the USA to work on golf courses and motels as well. Trump said he wanted to eliminate the VISA lottery but I don't think that happened.
    If Trump is not going to raise the national minimum wage and still lets foreigners work here he will be a one term president. American citizens will not see higher wages when they have to compete with foreigners. It is all about supply and demand.

    The unemployment rate is overstated. Trump explained why before the election when it was in his interest to blame it on Obama. Now it is not in his interest to talk about it. I have also heard that people with 2 jobs make it look like more people are employed than in reality too. Not sure if that is true, but it probably is.
    The poorer people get at the bottom the more powerful the rich get. Wealth has a trickle up effect that way. The elites love it!
  3. Germany
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    05 Sep '18 18:56
    Originally posted by @philokalia
    [quote]The real wages for American workers are continuing to decline. Yes, the CEOs of major corporations saw a 54 percent increase in their compensation. Yes, the stock market is hitting off the wall. Yes, the rich are getting richer. But what about the average worker. Well the front pages of corporate America’s newspapers don’t talk about it. But for t ...[text shortened]... e American workers, and not send our jobs over to desperate people who won't even truly benefit?
    There is no fundamental limit to the number of jobs.

    The United States has overwhelmingly more resources than what is required to guarantee a comfortable lifestyle for all of its inhabitants.

    Your concerns are invalid.
  4. Joined
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    05 Sep '18 19:10
    Originally posted by @philokalia
    [quote]The real wages for American workers are continuing to decline. Yes, the CEOs of major corporations saw a 54 percent increase in their compensation. Yes, the stock market is hitting off the wall. Yes, the rich are getting richer. But what about the average worker. Well the front pages of corporate America’s newspapers don’t talk about it. But for t ...[text shortened]... e American workers, and not send our jobs over to desperate people who won't even truly benefit?
    No, when work is produced more cheaply then prices will decrease and all will benefit. The free market shows that Americans are often overpaid... instead of crying that you deserve to be paid more understand that you are actually overpaid.
  5. Subscriberno1marauder
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    05 Sep '18 19:16
    Originally posted by @quackquack
    No, when work is produced more cheaply then prices will decrease and all will benefit. The free market shows that Americans are often overpaid... instead of crying that you deserve to be paid more understand that you are actually overpaid.
    You're right; it's a mystery why the average peasant in the US won't accept he should be further impoverished so that the plutocrats can have even more.
  6. Joined
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    05 Sep '18 19:551 edit
    Originally posted by @no1marauder
    You're right; it's a mystery why the average peasant in the US won't accept he should be further impoverished so that the plutocrats can have even more.
    Your ridiculous view that we should ignore the free market negotiated price and instead pay people what you think they deserve is humorous. From now on before anyone engages in commerce they should contact no1 and find out what fair price for their transaction is.
  7. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    06 Sep '18 00:01
    Originally posted by @kazetnagorra
    There is no fundamental limit to the number of jobs.

    The United States has overwhelmingly more resources than what is required to guarantee a comfortable lifestyle for all of its inhabitants.

    Your concerns are invalid.
    Very optimistic & capitalistic of you... And you do have a point.

    But here's my first riddle for you:

    If there is no limit to the amount of jobs and prosperity that can occur in the United States and Europe, isn't it also true that there is no limit to the amount of jobs and prosperity that can occur in Mexico or Haiti?

    So, why aren't we focusing on having these nations grow their economies and become better places?

    The reason why the economy in Mexico doesn't take off is the same reason why these people will not help our economy take off... New jobs is about skilled labor, more and more, and the natural resources markets are very, very complex, and many of the resources that have potential for more growth and profits due to increased extraction are even things that people want to fight against -- like fracking.

    Or are you Mr. Open Pit miner here and want to see the Northwest drive the global cost of paper into the ground with thousands of more mills?

    ... Because these illegals who are sometimes even illiterate in their own language are not the ones who will eb growing silicon valley...

    ... Silicon valley who now faces far more intense competition from China, heed you!
  8. Joined
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    06 Sep '18 00:12
    Originally posted by @philokalia
    [quote]The real wages for American workers are continuing to decline. Yes, the CEOs of major corporations saw a 54 percent increase in their compensation. Yes, the stock market is hitting off the wall. Yes, the rich are getting richer. But what about the average worker. Well the front pages of corporate America’s newspapers don’t talk about it. But for t ...[text shortened]... e American workers, and not send our jobs over to desperate people who won't even truly benefit?
    Hey. If you want to pay $5G for a 50" flat screen TV, by all means.

    Build them here !!
  9. Joined
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    06 Sep '18 00:27
    Originally posted by @kazetnagorra
    There is no fundamental limit to the number of jobs.

    The United States has overwhelmingly more resources than what is required to guarantee a comfortable lifestyle for all of its inhabitants.

    Your concerns are invalid.
    Resources don't create jobs. Those that hog the resources create jobs and they don't share for free. Wages only rise when the supply of laborers is less than demand for them. Importing foreign workers and outsourcing jobs increases the supply and suppresses wages.

    You seem to be an apologist for class warfare.
  10. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    06 Sep '18 00:28
    Originally posted by @mghrn55
    Hey. If you want to pay $5G for a 50" flat screen TV, by all means.

    Build them here !!
    Cutting edge flat screens do cost five grand, though.

    Cheapos cost four hundy.

    Yiu saying Americans wouldn't be able to make a cheapo quality one for five or six hundy?
  11. Germany
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    06 Sep '18 06:33
    Originally posted by @philokalia
    The reason why the economy in Mexico doesn't take off is the same reason why these people will not help our economy take off...
    No, it's not.
  12. Germany
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    06 Sep '18 06:37
    Originally posted by @metal-brain
    Resources don't create jobs. Those that hog the resources create jobs and they don't share for free. Wages only rise when the supply of laborers is less than demand for them. Importing foreign workers and outsourcing jobs increases the supply and suppresses wages.

    You seem to be an apologist for class warfare.
    Through fiscal policy, governments can make net wages for workers anything they want them to be (within reasonable limits).

    I am an apologist for a classless society.
  13. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    06 Sep '18 07:26
    Originally posted by @kazetnagorra
    No, it's not.
    Oh, OK.

    So... You think that, given enough unskilled labor immigrating to our country, our nation's economy will appropriately expand?

    Let me guess... You can't elaborate on this idea, but that is the case, right? And I'll just get some curt response like this one..?
  14. Joined
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    06 Sep '18 08:39
    Originally posted by @kazetnagorra
    Through fiscal policy, governments can make net wages for workers anything they want them to be (within reasonable limits).

    I am an apologist for a classless society.
    Yes, but the elites don't want a classless society. The gap between the rich and poor is what makes the rich powerful. In a classless society the rich would have to do a lot of the work they normally hire others to do. Buying off politicians would be harder as well. They don't want that.
  15. Germany
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    06 Sep '18 15:59
    Originally posted by @metal-brain
    Yes, but the elites don't want a classless society. The gap between the rich and poor is what makes the rich powerful. In a classless society the rich would have to do a lot of the work they normally hire others to do. Buying off politicians would be harder as well. They don't want that.
    The "elites" have already established classless societies (or at least something close to it) in Europe, and there is no reason the U.S. could not emulate them.
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