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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. 07 Jun '09 00:37
    Will be provided periodically tomorrow and the day after, live, in this thread. It'll come in fits and starts based on my internet usage, but in case anyone's interested ...

    The winners of the Parliamentary elections are being announced Monday at noon, Beirut time.
  2. 07 Jun '09 00:51 / 2 edits
    The major candidates are:

    The March 14 Alliance: generally anti-Syrian and anti-Pan-Arab
    Future Movement (Harakat al-Mustaqbal): led by Sa'ad Hariri, US-backed and capitalist with strong Sunni constituency
    Progressive Socialist Party: socialist and Masonic, large secular and Druze constituencies
    Qornet Shehwan Gathering (comprised of)
    Lebanese Forces: right-wing Nationalist Lebanese with strong Christian backing
    Democratic Renewal Party: moderately leftist pro-reform party
    Phalangist Party (Kata'ib Lubnaniya): ultra-right-wing Fascist party of Lebanon
    National Liberal Party: moderately leftist and Christian
    Independence Movement: centrist and nationalist

    VS.

    March 8 Alliance (Opposition): pro-Syrian and pro-Pan-Arabist
    The Party of God (Hizb'allah): very left-wing progressive and generally Shi'a; led by Hassan Nasrallah; responsible for the liberation of South Lebanon in 2000 and the removal of occupying forces in 2006
    The Movement of Hope (Harakat Amal): strongly Syrian-backed and very supportive of the Syrian regime
    Free Patriotic Movement (al-Tayyar al-wattani al-hurr): moderately leftist, mostly Maronite party
  3. 07 Jun '09 14:21
    The Opposition is up slightly, judging by exit polls and AJI.
  4. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    07 Jun '09 15:13 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by scherzo
    The Party of God (Hizb'allah): very left-wing progressive and generally Shi'a; led by Hassan Nasrallah; responsible for the liberation of South Lebanon in 2000 and the removal of occupying forces in 2006
    They get credit for "the removal of occupying forces in 2006" but you don't bother to mention that their reckless actions were the reason the "occupying forces" came in the first place in 2006?
  5. 07 Jun '09 15:26
    Originally posted by sh76
    They get credit for "the removal of occupying forces in 2006" but you don't bother to mention that their reckless actions were the reason the "occupying forces" came in the first place in 2006?
    It's called war. Soldiers die. It's not like they were civilians.
  6. 07 Jun '09 15:30
    From the Daily Star: "Lebanon's Future is in the Hands of a Small Number of Districts."

    The Christian communities may decide the outcome of this election, depending on who votes for the FPM in the Opposition and who votes for the Phalange and LF in the March 14.

    http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=1&categ_id=2&article_id=102742
  7. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    07 Jun '09 15:34 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by scherzo
    It's called war. Soldiers die. It's not like they were civilians.
    In what way was there a war between Israel and Lebanon before the 2006 soldier kidnappings? There was only a "war" because Hizbollah started it. Before the attack, Israel had no reason to move into South Lebanon in 2006.
  8. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    07 Jun '09 15:36 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76
    In what way was there a war between Israel and Lebanon before the 2006 soldier kidnappings? There was only a "war" because Hizbollah started it.
    Please, stop spewing out propaganda.

    Israel remains in occupation of Lebanese territory and has invaded Lebanon several times in the last 25 years. And soldiers can't be "kidnapped" while they are engaging in military operations.

    EDIT: Maybe this might help: http://www.shebaafarms.org/briefhistory.html
  9. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    07 Jun '09 15:47
    Does sh76 feel beholden or is he sincere? I must say I have wondered. On this and most everything else. Is there a certain pressure on him that I, as a non-American, am not aware of?
  10. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    07 Jun '09 15:52 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by FMF
    Does sh76 feel beholden or is he sincere? I must say I have wondered. On this and most everything else. Is there a certain pressure on him that I, as a non-American, am not aware of?
    Personalizing these discussions are counterproductive.
  11. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    07 Jun '09 15:57
    Originally posted by FMF
    Does sh76 feel beholden or is he sincere? I must say I have wondered. On this and most everything else. Is there a certain pressure on him that I, as a non-American, am not aware of?
    Other than the three CIA agents standing behind me with their guns drawn, I am under no pressure to take any specific position.
  12. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    07 Jun '09 16:09
    There seems to have been an unprecedented high turn out. http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2009/06/20096714241072111.html

    Supporters of democracy should be cheered, though I suspect that the spruce crowd will find Lebanese democracy defective if the opposition wins.

    It does seem the parliament is skewed towards the Christians; though they are only 40% of the population, they are guaranteed half the seats.
  13. Standard member spruce112358
    Democracy Advocate
    07 Jun '09 18:57
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    There seems to have been an unprecedented high turn out. http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2009/06/20096714241072111.html

    Supporters of democracy should be cheered, though I suspect that the spruce crowd will find Lebanese democracy defective if the opposition wins.

    It does seem the parliament is skewed toward ...[text shortened]... the Christians; though they are only 40% of the population, they are guaranteed half the seats.
    Who is 'the spruce crowd'? If you talking about the Lebanese flag, that's a cedar, not a spruce.
  14. Standard member spruce112358
    Democracy Advocate
    07 Jun '09 19:02
    In the Pine family (Pinaceae), we have:

    Subfamily Pinoideae
    Pinus - pines (about 115 species)

    Subfamily Piceoideae
    Picea - spruces (about 35 species)

    Subfamily Laricoideae
    Cathaya (one species)
    Larix - larches (about 14 species)
    Pseudotsuga - douglas-firs (five species)

    Subfamily Abietoideae
    Pseudolarix - golden larch (one species)
    Abies - firs (about 50 species)
    Cedrus - cedars (two to four species)
    Keteleeria (three species)
    Nothotsuga (one species)
    Tsuga - hemlock (nine species)

    (courtesy of wikipedia!)
  15. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    07 Jun '09 21:38 / 1 edit
    Reuters is reporting the government coalition has won, albeit by a narrow margin. http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSTRE55609720090607?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews