Originally posted by StarValleyWy
That is at least a cogent paragraph, so i will try to explain my stupid and probably irrelevant ideas on the subject.
Oddly enough, I've said it at least twice before (above),
and the point reinforced by several other people.
What "magic" surplants one of the 5 senses that humans have?
As I am not deaf, much less born-deaf, I cannot answer this question.
However, the people I know who are born-deaf attest to it and I have
no reasons to disbelieve them.
A book or a story? Does that make it real? I would be more impressed had the 'deaf' couple moved off the tracks before the train killed them and their five screaming "hearing" children.
For every horror story which has 'deafness: the handicap' as its root there is
a miracle story with 'deafness: an ironic gift' as its root.
You will have to interact with born-deaf people to believe it. I cannot
give you a definitive answer, but they can.
Nemesio
Originally posted by NemesioI've worked with deaf people; I wouldn't argue that a deaf person isn't leading a full life, depends on the person.
Originally posted by StarValleyWy
[b]That is at least a cogent paragraph, so i will try to explain my stupid and probably irrelevant ideas on the subject.
Oddly enough, I've said it at least twice before (above),
and the point reinforced by several other people.
What "magic" surplants one of the 5 senses that humans have?
As I ...[text shortened]... orn-deaf people to believe it. I cannot
give you a definitive answer, but they can.
Nemesio[/b]
The question is, should I applaud these parents for attempting to have a deaf child so that they can relate to it better? No, because the kid will have a life after his childhood where, if not for his parents, he might have had hearing.
Originally posted by Nemesio
Originally posted by pcaspian
[b]Clearly then its no business of yours what a paedophile does to his children ? I take it female circumcision is also right up your broad path of morality ?
The fact that you would consider deafness and pedophila in the same category
only demonstrates the perversion of your thought process.
Nemesio[/b]
Your "conclusion" demonstrates the fact that you are trying hard not to understand the things Pcaspian is trying to communicate.
Originally posted by Nemesio
Please ask anyone born deaf if they feel like they are a victim. Or disabled. Or handicapped.
I think you will find that most will say that they do not feel like a victim. In fact, many of them
feel part of a culture of deafness, part of a group of people with a different view of the world.
Many describe their experience as enriched through their deafness.
Actually you would need to ask someone who was purposefully designed to be deaf, or who's hearing was removed from them whether they feel like a victim, so thanks for your input, but its actually quite useless in this discussion. Perhaps let no1 do his own talking ?
Originally posted by pcaspianThey can ask these children when they grow up and I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts they'll say they love their parents and are grateful. Of course, you've consistently misrepresented what the couple did (even the thread title is inaccurate); they enhanced the odds of the children being born deaf but so do two deaf people having children. You haven't told me why one is morally condemnable and the other isn't. Try to do it without your usual bile.
[b/]Originally posted by Nemesio
Please ask anyone born deaf if they feel like they are a victim. Or disabled. Or handicapped.
I think you will find that most will say that they do not feel like a victim. In fact, many of t ...[text shortened]... less in this discussion. Perhaps let no1 do his own talking ?
Originally posted by no1marauder
They can ask these children when they grow up and I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts they'll say they love their parents and are grateful.
A child's love for its parents is inconsequential to the issue of morality.
Of course, you've consistently misrepresented what the couple did (even the thread title is inaccurate); they enhanced the odds of the children being born deaf but so do two deaf people having children.
Two normal deaf people choosing to become parents do not do so hoping their child will also suffer the same shortfalls they had to suffer, in fact (as Nyxie stated) any loving parent wants the best for their children. Take any two parents with a genetic defect and they will hope and pray their children would not suffer the same fate as them.
This couple, not only wanted their children to also lack the gift of hearing, indeed they went to the extreme to ensure their children would have significantly higher chance of being born deaf than had they tried to conceive naturally. Imagine your parents told you... there was a 50% chance of you being a jerkoff, but just to make sure, we got some semen from a convict ?
Originally posted by AThousandYoung1 Surgery may repair the eardrums, don't know if that's possible
How is this situation different than if the parents deliberately popped the kid's eardrums at birth?
And how is it different from intentionally having a thalidomide baby?
How is having two people with an identical genetic disability have children different from incest?
2 Why? Hard to see anyone desiring that, in this case, the parents had a selfish, romantic desire.
3 No idea, don't know what you mean.
Originally posted by pcaspianPcaspian to no1: " ... Imagine your parents told you... there was a 50% chance of you being a jerkoff, but just to make sure, we got some semen from a convict ? "
Originally posted by no1marauder
[b] They can ask these children when they grow up and I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts they'll say they love their parents and are grateful.
A child's love for its parents is inconsequential to the issue of morality.
Of course, you've consistently misrepresented what the couple did (even th ...[text shortened]... chance of you being a jerkoff, but just to make sure, we got some semen from a convict ?
...... whooooohooooo ...... 😀 🙄 😀
Originally posted by pcaspianYou just can't or won't understand that these people don't think of being deaf as being a "genetic defect". Of course, this couple being lesbians, couldn't conceive "naturally" anyway; if they were a male and female deaf couple who could conceive naturally the result would have been the same. I fail to see why their finding a surrogate sperm donor who is deaf is any different from using a natural sperm donor who is deaf given that these people don't think of deafness as a handicap. If it becomes possible for parents to bio-engineer their children with a high intelligence level should they be required to do so because others believe that would be "best" for the children?
[b/]Originally posted by no1marauder
They can ask these children when they grow up and I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts they'll say they love their parents and are grateful.
A child's love for its parents is incon ...[text shortened]... but just to make sure, we got some semen from a convict ?
[/b]
Originally posted by pcaspianHere is your problem pcaspian:
Two normal deaf people choosing to become parents do not do so [b]hoping their child will also suffer the same shortfalls they had to suffer, in fact (as Nyxie stated) any loving parent wants the best for their children. Take any two parents with a genetic defect and they will hope and pray their children would not suffer the same fate as them.[/b]
*Born-deaf people do not consider that they have a 'shortfall.'
*Born-deaf people do not feel like they have a genetic 'defect.'
*Born-deaf people do not feel that they are 'suffering.'
Stop projecting your feelings about the nature of deafness on the born-deaf
community.
Nemesio
Originally posted by Nemesio
Here is your problem pcaspian:
*Born-deaf people do not consider that they have a 'shortfall.'
*Born-deaf people do not feel like they have a genetic 'defect.'
*Born-deaf people do not feel that they are 'suffering.'
Stop projecting your feelings about the nature of deafness on the born-deaf
community.
Nemesio
Your political correct bla bla stinks, Nemesio