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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. 03 Jul '09 19:04
    this will probably be a rant, so i'll put it in the debates section ....

    i don't mind local councils, but council tax, and its predecessors, are very annoying ..
    My understanding is the amount local govt receives is still dictated by Westminster.
    councils that don't generate enough are topped up (please correct me if wrong).

    But still there is this beurocratic system of collecting tax at a local level,
    which probably works worst where most funding is needed most...

    Personally i find VAT & income tax good... in i pay quite a lot but don't seem to notice.
    council tax however, particularly where liability is split is a nightmare ...
    it also seems hard on pensioners... i think tax on savings is fairer.

    I was puzzled when we had a VAT cut to boost spending ... as the high street was already providing quite cheap goods, I would have upped VAT and done away with council tax completely ... not sure if this is possible economically? .. but i think people would have felt like they had more money.

    Any thoughts? should we get rid of council tax / How would it be replaced?
  2. 03 Jul '09 19:15
    Originally posted by Black Star Uchess
    this will probably be a rant, so i'll put it in the debates section ....

    i don't mind local councils, but council tax, and its predecessors, are very annoying ..
    My understanding is the amount local govt receives is still dictated by Westminster.
    councils that don't generate enough are topped up (please correct me if wrong).

    But still the ...[text shortened]... ad more money.

    Any thoughts? should we get rid of council tax / How would it be replaced?
    like we have a choice or our opinion counts for anything.
    all we can do is choose to vote for the dumb party or the dumber party.
    end of
  3. 03 Jul '09 20:55
    Originally posted by Black Star Uchess
    beurocratic system
    Brilliant! Did you make that one up yourself?
  4. 03 Jul '09 21:37
    everyone i know in Brighton who does not work for the council, dislikes them ,

    it's not that they provide bad services, actually quite good ... it's just council tax .. everyone i know or there mate has had some row about it . no other tax i know causes more trouble so something must be wrong with it ...
  5. Standard member Redmike
    Godless Commie
    03 Jul '09 21:48
    Originally posted by Black Star Uchess
    no other tax i know causes more trouble so something must be wrong with it ...
    Forgotten the poll tax then?
  6. 04 Jul '09 00:44 / 1 edit
    no , i remember the riots.. the council tax is by far the most oppressive tax to those on low incomes
    single people and pensioners . increasingly big chunk of the population ... it is mildly better then the poll tax yes ... but still an elephant of stupidity .

    Edit . it has minimal linkings to a persons wealth,
    is amongst the most avoided taxes. increasing the burden on those who pay
    the administration is duplicated across hundreds councils, where one could do the same function
    it inefficiency creates a parasite industry of bailifs and non service council staff feeding from those on low incomes.

    how many more reason can a tax be bad... compare with VAT n income tax...
  7. Standard member Redmike
    Godless Commie
    04 Jul '09 06:53
    Originally posted by Black Star Uchess
    no , i remember the riots.. the council tax is by far the most oppressive tax to those on low incomes
    single people and pensioners . increasingly big chunk of the population ... it is mildly better then the poll tax yes ... but still an elephant of stupidity .

    Edit . it has minimal linkings to a persons wealth,
    is amongst the most avoided ta ...[text shortened]... e on low incomes.

    how many more reason can a tax be bad... compare with VAT n income tax...
    I agree about the council tax, just making the point that we've had worse.

    I'm for a local income tax - we'd have had such a system in Scotland, but the SNP, despite it being in their manifesto, have decided against now they're in power.
  8. 04 Jul '09 09:40
    I agree. Council tax is not only regressive, there is also not much incentive for councils to keep their spending at bay. It's better to fund councils from the national government instead, and replace council tax by income tax.
  9. Standard member InlandRevenueUK
    Cause I'm the taxman
    04 Jul '09 15:31
    Feel it would be appropriate for me to comment!

    I completely agree, council tax is completely unfair as it attacks the lowest income groups.

    All taxation should be managed by central government
  10. Standard member Redmike
    Godless Commie
    04 Jul '09 18:52
    Originally posted by InlandRevenueUK
    Feel it would be appropriate for me to comment!

    I completely agree, council tax is completely unfair as it attacks the lowest income groups.

    All taxation should be managed by central government
    If it is all managed centrally, what's the point of local government?
  11. 04 Jul '09 19:13
    Originally posted by Redmike
    If it is all managed centrally, what's the point of local government?
    The local government doesn't have to tax the local population to function.
  12. Standard member Redmike
    Godless Commie
    04 Jul '09 19:28
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    The local government doesn't have to tax the local population to function.
    No, but there's not much left of the council's role if they've no financial management role.
  13. 04 Jul '09 19:32
    Originally posted by Redmike
    No, but there's not much left of the council's role if they've no financial management role.
    They will have a financial management role; they will have to spend the funds allocated by the national government wisely.
  14. 04 Jul '09 21:15 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by InlandRevenueUK
    Feel it would be appropriate for me to comment!

    I completely agree, council tax is completely unfair as it attacks the lowest income groups.

    All taxation should be managed by central government
    good to have someone who agrees.

    the trouble is no council would oppose it... but it needs to be gotten rid of .
  15. 04 Jul '09 21:39 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Redmike
    I agree about the council tax, just making the point that we've had worse.

    I'm for a local income tax - we'd have had such a system in Scotland, but the SNP, despite it being in their manifesto, have decided against now they're in power.
    interesting, am opposed to local income tax as it would be even more beurocratic then the current system ..again you just replicate the job of the treasury across 100s of councils ... then top them again as some will still not make enough... it sounds 'fair' but think it would not work,

    the harsh truth is most of the council staff and bailiffs associated with the tax.. 1000s..
    serve no useful purpose. we could have less tax / more services without them ..