@no1marauder saidYou keep bolding where it mentions Thomas' performance decreased. That's obvious if she's taken hormone therapy to transition to a woman. The issue is whether or not that decrease is enough to erase advantages she had as a man.
The data says Thomas has no clear advantage and that her treatments have resulted in lesser performance:
"Thomas began swimming on the men's team at the University of Pennsylvania in 2017, and during her freshman year, recorded a time of 8 minutes and 57.55 seconds in the 1,000-yard freestyle that ranked as the sixth-fastest national men's time, as well as 500-yard fre ...[text shortened]... in the United States for the 2021-2022 season.[/b][25]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lia_Thomas
If peer-reviewed evidence suggests that she had no natural advantage, then I'm fine with it.
@vivify saidLMAO!
This merely says that we shouldn't prejudge transwomen as having advantages; it doesn't say they don't have advantages.
Carefully read your sources before posting them.
But that's EXACTLY what you have done; you've prejudged the matter.
Thomas has followed the rules the NCAA put in place (starting in 2011) to mitigate any supposed "advantage" a transgender woman might have.
@no1marauder saidWould you talk like this if we were ensconced at a Pub? Then, why do it here?
The International Olympic Committee, which might be a bit more knowledgeable about such matters than sh, mott, aj and yourself has established that there is "no presumption of advantage" for transgender women in any sport (https://stillmed.olympics.com/media/Documents/News/2021/11/IOC-Framework-Fairness-Inclusion-Non-discrimination-2021.pdf?_ga=2.116948229.2094909257.1637 ...[text shortened]... monstrates a consistent, unfair competitive advantage in the specific sport regulated (paragraph 6).
@averagejoe1 saidUMMMMMMMMMMM .......................................................
Would you talk like this if we were ensconced at a Pub? Then, why do it here?
Because this is a "Debates Forum" not a pub?
@no1marauder saidAgain, testosterone is only one area. Natural height advantages, shoulder width, etc., can't be erased with hormone therapy.
LMAO!
But that's EXACTLY what you have done; you've prejudged the matter.
Thomas has followed the rules the NCAA put in place (starting in 2011) to mitigate any supposed "advantage" a transgender woman might have.
@vivify saidShould Katy Ledecky be barred from competition because she's taller than the average woman? There's lots of tall cisgender women, short cisgender men, cisgender women with more muscular builds than normal, cisgender men without muscular builds, etc. etc. etc.
Again, testosterone is only one area. Natural height advantages, shoulder width, etc., can't be erased with hormone therapy.
World class athletes generally have physical advantages over non world class athletes. Unless you want to adopt Harrison Bergeron rules, that's not going to change.
@no1marauder saidNo I haven't. Thomas is 6'1. The average height for female Olympic swimmers is 5'9:
LMAO!
But that's EXACTLY what you have done; you've prejudged the matter.
https://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/news/what-makes-the-perfect-swimmers-body/#:~:text=In%20fact%2C%20the%20average%20height,higher%20than%20the%20average%20human.
I didn't "prejudge", she objectively has natural advantages over other women
@no1marauder saidNot if that advantage was gained naturally as a woman. That's not the case for Thomas.
Should Katy Ledecky be barred from competition because she's taller than the average woman?
@vivify saidRead my last post.
No I haven't. Thomas is 6'1. The average height for female Olympic swimmers is 5'9:
https://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/news/what-makes-the-perfect-swimmers-body/#:~:text=In%20fact%2C%20the%20average%20height,higher%20than%20the%20average%20human.
I didn't "prejudge", she objectively has natural advantages over other women
You're clutching at straws now.
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@no1marauder saidFor swimmers, 6'1 is an exceptional height for women; that's average for men like Thomas was before transitioning.
That's absurd. A person's height is the result of many factors, some "natural", others not so much. https://www.sciencealert.com/environmental-factors-play-a-part-in-your-height-according-to-experts
@vivify saidwhat happened to settling if a person who is not 100% woman can compete as a woman. Further, have you suggested that the definition of a woman (Webster's) can be different in other venues? If so, tell us how that is explained to a 14 year old.
For swimmers, 6'1 is an exceptional height for women; that's average for men like Thomas was before transitioning.
@averagejoe1 saidLook up the word "gender".
what happened to settling if a person who is not 100% woman can compete as a woman. Further, have you suggested that the definition of a woman (Webster's) can be different in other venues? If so, tell us how that is explained to a 14 year old.
@AverageJoe1
She won't be playing those ultrarightwingnutjobs grandstanding games.
You want to weaponize ANYTHING you think will put down Biden.
You care nothing about the actual person Jackson but ONLY want to cast our president in bad light.
Hint: It doesn't work.
@sonhouse said“ You want to weaponize ANYTHING you think will put down Biden. ”
@AverageJoe1
She won't be playing those ultrarightwingnutjobs grandstanding games.
You want to weaponize ANYTHING you think will put down Biden.
You care nothing about the actual person Jackson but ONLY want to cast our president in bad light.
Hint: It doesn't work.
biden does a bang up job of destroying himself