Originally posted by Svin1Of course, but if you're behind a firewall (which you shouldn't have permissions to open ports for), the keylogger is useless. The only outgoing connections you should be allowed to make are ones made by trusted programs using known ports (21, 80 etc etc).
Substitute the program with a script then, it's just an example. You can do bad stuff even if you're confined to a home directory; not bad stuff that affects the operating system itself, but keyloggers and general snooping is possible. Something as simple as this example relies on naive users rather than weak security and there's not that many really naive Linux users out there, but if everybody used Linux, there *would* be dimwitted users galore.
True, though, to the naive Linux user that security is not likely, but you're still less vulnerable than Windows, especially with it's default security settings.
Originally posted by Svin1Is it 90% of webservers are running linux? Cant recall exactly but I know it's a very large percentage...certainly apache (open source) is the dominant webserver application.
There's really no fun in viruses on Linux, there's much too few users. If you make malware aimed for Windows, you're targetting more than 90% of all desktops (more users = better spread) and security is weaker; as an added bonus, you'll find all of the dumbest users on the internet in your target-group. If you make an effective virus that hits Windows, you ...[text shortened]... ripple the local newspaper, piss off 1000 pimpled teenagers and make a headline on slashdot.org.
If you could write an effective virus to bring down the linux/GNU/apache webservers you could probably produce the most costly virus outbreak of all time. Your hacker name would be plastered on all the headlines everywhere. You'd piss billions off...
It's not just the % of people that use windows, it's the fact that 90% of the people writing these virus's are just as much dumbasses as the users and probably dont have the skills to write a virus for anything other than windows.
MÅ¥HÅRM
Originally posted by MayharmAccording to netcraft <http://news.netcraft.com/archives/web_server_survey.html> around 70% of all web servers run Apache, but I was refering to desktops.
Is it 90% of webservers are running linux? Cant recall exactly but I know it's a very large percentage...certainly apache (open source) is the dominant webserver application.
If you could write an effective virus to bring down the linux/GNU/apache webservers you could probably produce the most costly virus outbreak of all time. Your hacker name would be ...[text shortened]... s and probably dont have the skills to write a virus for anything other than windows.
MÅ¥HÅRM
Targetting web servers with viruses would be difficult cause there's no direct way to have them spread it among themselves, whereas desktops has an effective virus-'interface': e-mail.
Originally posted by Svin1E-mail? Fine. Compare the difficulty of creating a virus for sendmail over exchange. That's probably got a fairly huge market share as well.
According to netcraft <http://news.netcraft.com/archives/web_server_survey.html> around 70% of all web servers run Apache, but I was refering to desktops.
Targetting web servers with viruses would be difficult cause there's no direct way to have them spread it among themselves, whereas desktops has an effective virus-'interface': e-mail.
Desktops? Well someone already covered of the main reasons why it wouldn't happen easily on linux, malicious software pretty much needs root access to do anything worthwhile.
I understand that you were refering only to desktops, but I was speaking more to your perception that windows is more "fun" to write virus's (or other malicious software) for because of it's larger coverage. The only place windows has a particularly large coverage is in the desktop OS market, but it's not the only product from microsoft with huge security flaws that are actively being taken advantage of, "direct mechanism" or no.
What I'm saying is that 90% of the virus writers wouldn't have the smarts to write them for linux, let alone have "fun" doing it. They have "fun" with microsoft because it's so easy in relation to the "rewards"...
Untill microsoft's level of incompetency is eliminated you wont see much, if any, activity in producing virus's for linux. And even then it wont be nearly as bad as now because the bar will be raised far above the abilities of most of the people who would be interested in doing it.
MÅ¥HÅRM
SVW,
Your words on this matter are wise. In an ideal world, open source has a lot of merit. But, in practice, folks need the systems to work, and they need software compatability. Microsoft offers that. And most specialized software for particular businesses is written so it works harmoniously with Microsoft.
Originally posted by WulebgrI imported an Excel spreadsheet using OpenOffice Calc; this isn't your average spreadsheet with a sum here and there, this is full of complicated concatenations and conditional ifs (not to mention formatting). When I opened it in Calc, I was surprised to see not only that the formulae still worked, even the formatting was the same. It worked just the same as it did on Excel. When I saved it in Calc's native format, it was roughly half the size. That is compatibility.
SVW,
Your words on this matter are wise. In an ideal world, open source has a lot of merit. But, in practice, folks need the systems to work, and they need software compatability. Microsoft offers that. And most specialized software for particular businesses is written so it works harmoniously with Microsoft.
And who is saying Linux doesn't work as a possible alternate solution to Microsoft? I know a few firms that are glad they made the change, and I know even more firms willing to make it once they are ready (have necessary tools to migrate data and so on).
And why the hell "End Task" still fluffs around sometimes I don't know. You click it, and it waits and waits and waits before finally saying that the program is not responding (and this is usually the reason you terminate it). Good ol' "kill" command in Linux (or "killall"😉; much faster way to kill apps, and guaranteed to work (just don't use the wrong pid!).
1 edit
Originally posted by DreamlaXYou pretty much "got it".
Sorry, I understand now.
So spending a bucketload on an OS and software which is hardly secure (and requires ten security updates every week) and only runs on Intel compatible PCs is just as correct as spending no money on a secure OS w ...[text shortened]... ll). It says even on linux.org that Linux is used in things alike.
I work for customers who "buy" their own hardware and software.
I just do the best I can with the tools they give me.
I would love for once to have a customer spring for the really good stuff in Oracle etc...
But I'm not holding my breath. I am in business to turn a buck. I do that by supplying what my customers want.
They do the spending. I do the database and programs.
So far... out of 88 customers with a million in sales... that is all Microsoft.
Go figure. Maybe you need to get the word out to the rest of the world. I don't really care. SQL is sql. I would love to use T-SQL to build my methods and db's in Oracle. If I ever get a really big rich customer.
The problem is that "I" make them big and "rich". So why change? From their point of view?
<edit> T-SQL is "transact structured query language" and is the model used to define databases, procedures and methods in ALL modern structured query language dbms'.
Originally posted by DreamlaXWould like to just mention that "kill -9" isn't guaranteed to work. A common example is when you try and kill a "tar" that is writing to a broken device. It won't die, re-boot is the only way to get rid of it. A process won't die while it is blocking on i/o. I imagine Windows is the same. I will admit that Windows seems to do it a lot more than Linux though.
I imported an Excel spreadsheet using OpenOffice Calc; this isn't your average spreadsheet with a sum here and there, this is full of complicated concatenations and conditional ifs (not to mention formatting). When I opened it in Calc, I was surprised to see not only that the formulae still worked, even the formatting was the same. It worked just the same ...[text shortened]... llall"😉; much faster way to kill apps, and guaranteed to work (just don't use the wrong pid!).
I too have done that OpenOffice test. The file produced by OpenOffice is always much much smaller.
1 edit
Originally posted by WulebgrSure - they offer compatibility with Microsoft!
SVW,
Your words on this matter are wise. In an ideal world, open source has a lot of merit. But, in practice, folks need the systems to work, and they need software compatability. Microsoft offers that. And most specialized software for ...[text shortened]... lar businesses is written so it works harmoniously with Microsoft.
Here is Microsoft's nightmare. A major Government computer user - India, China? decides they will not contine with restrictions and Microsoft license fees. Schools. libraries, offices all using open source exclusively - and everyone else needs to be compatible with Open Office. It vitalises the countries software industry as new open source based opportunities open up - and no more whining from the US about software piracy.
Meanwhile - think about RedHotPawn. I don't know what OS the server runs on - but to play chess, you only need a browser. Windows. Mac, Linux on your machine - it does not make a difference to RHP. And when RHP upgrades - only the server, not our machines need to be changed, And that is where business is headed - a grunty server and off the shelf desktops running a browser and a few simple applications like wordprocessing and e-mail. Easy to buy, easy to replace - and these can all be Linux boxes.
Originally posted by steerpikeMicrosoft products are barely compatible with themselves🙂
Sure - they offer compatibility with Microsoft!
Here is Microsoft's nightmare. A major Government computer user - India, China? decides they will not contine with restrictions and Microsoft license fees. Schools. libraries, offices all using open source exclusively - and everyone else needs to be compatible with Open Office. It vitalises the countrie ...[text shortened]... pen source based opportunities open up - and no more whining from the US about software piracy.
When the Peruvian State decided to run open source software exclusively, Microsoft's General Manager in Peru sent a letter to the congress and explained how OSS was forged by Satan himself. The original letter is quoted in the reply the congress sent back: http://www.gnu.org.pe/resmseng.html. Way to go Peru!
1 edit
Originally posted by Svin1Good negiotating position- hey, Microsoft, we are thinking of dumping you and using Linux. Now about that quote .....
Microsoft products are barely compatible with themselves🙂
When the Peruvian State decided to run open source software exclusively, Microsoft's General Manager in Peru sent a letter to the congress and explained how OSS was forged by Sata ...[text shortened]... k: [b]http://www.gnu.org.pe/resmseng.html. Way to go Peru!
[/b]
You MS users ever stop to think what Microsoft would charge if Windows was the only choice?
Even if you don't use it on your desktop - you should thank Linux developers and users for providing competition to Microsoft and keeping prices down.
Originally posted by steerpikeSeven or eight years ago the price of Microsoft Windows and Office was about the price of a new, low-end PC today, unless you obtained an academic liscense.
Good negiotating position- hey, Microsoft, we are thinking of dumping you and using Linux. Now about that quote .....
You MS users ever stop to think what Microsoft would charge if Windows was the only choice?
Even if you don't use it on your desktop - you should thank Linux developers and users for providing competition to Microsoft and keeping prices down.
Originally posted by steerpikeAre you asking me? I don't use MS. Maybe it came out the wrong way, but I support Peru's decision to use open source and wish that my own country would do the same...
You MS users ever stop to think what Microsoft would charge if Windows was the only choice?
Even if you don't use it on your desktop - you should thank Linux developers and users for providing competition to Microsoft and keeping prices down.