Originally posted by ivangriceHuh? in other words, everything that you don't know anything about is elitist? That's absurd.
"I can see that this is an ironic twist on the Greek legend of Danae and the shower of gold, a subject that has been treated by other artists such as Titian and Klimt, for example."
Sounds pretty elitist to me.
Originally posted by lauseyTechnical skill will always take a back seat to artistic insight. You can teach anyone to draw a straight line, but you can't teach them to generate profound ideas.* Your idea of "artistic" is far too narrow. No artist should ever allow himself to be confined to such a narrow perimiter.
I suppose different people have very different ideas of art. Although Emin's meaning behind "I got all" could be very philisophical or profound, her approach just does not appear very artistic to me. It just seems to me that she wants to bring some ideas across but is very poor at representing it.
Poutray this in a very well done painting, or as poetry, th ...[text shortened]... imagination, but I cannot see her being able to do still life.
I will stick to Dali. 🙂
*Although Barnett Newman made some rather profound straight lines. (that's an 'elitist' artist joke for you).
Originally posted by ivangriceI disagree. Elitism would be if I belittled you becuase of your lack of familiarity with Titian and Klimt and implied that you were somehow inferior because of it. It's a negative impulse. But if I'm encouraging you to expand yourself a little and make that connection between the works, then I don't see that as being elitist at all. I see that as being more inspirational.
I didn't say I didn't know about it.
I would say that the ability to contextualise in this way implies intellect and education.
That to me equals elitism. I'm not against it.
Originally posted by catfoodtimWasn't being tongue and cheek at all. I really do like Dali.
well, as BDN rightly pointed out at the start, a 'what is art' thread has been done. and didnt really go anywhere.
i couldnt tell if you were being tongue in cheek about dali?
why not do as Varg did - Emin is a bit extreme. There must be some modern art you can appreciate?
Originally posted by rwingettCan't argue with that. Will just have to broaden my horizons. 🙂
Technical skill will always take a back seat to artistic insight. You can teach anyone to draw a straight line, but you can't teach them to generate profound ideas.* Your idea of "artistic" is far too narrow. No artist should ever allow himself to be confined to such a narrow perimiter.
*Although Barnett Newman made some rather profound straight lines. (that's an 'elitist' artist joke for you).
Originally posted by ivangriceWhat kind of art do you like, Ivangrice?
I didn't say I didn't know about it.
I would say that the ability to contextualise in this way implies intellect and education.
That to me equals elitism. I'm not against it.
And what, specifically, do you consider to be 'modern art'?
1 edit
A lot of people entertain the remarkable thought that modern art cannot be understood or even more ridiculously they describe modern art as a concept which should not have the aim, the purpose or even the property of being understandable.
On the basis of the above acknowledgements and because a lot of modern art is indeed very difficult to understand and because a lot of modern art is indeed not understood at all gave other people, self proclaimed artists, the idea to produce a lot of non-sense which is by definition not understandable. They also proclaim this non-sense to be modern art ..... and that's why you can come across so much modern art which is absolute rubbish ..... if you visit the many art galleries in your local equivalent of mainstreet you can admire that rubbish in all its glory. If you are in desperate need for a good laugh I advise you to go and take a look in these would be galleries ........ and if you have the chance you really should try and engage in a conversation about modern art with the owners of these temples of Civilisation and Culture .......
Originally posted by ivanhoeYou sound just like Goebbels railing on against the 'degenerate art' of the German Expressionists.
A lot of people entertain the remarkable thought that modern art cannot be understood or even more ridiculously they describe modern art as a concept which should not have the aim, the purpose or even the property of being understandable.
On the basis of the above acknowledgements and because a lot of modern art is indeed very difficult to understand and ...[text shortened]... versation about modern art with the owners of these temples of Civilisation and Culture .......
Would you have us cram the galleries full of paintings of the Madonna and Child, like in the good old days when the Church was dictating what should be painted?
2 edits
Originally posted by rwingettRwrongo: "You sound just like Goebbels railing on against the 'degenerate art' of the German Expressionists."
You sound just like Goebbels railing on against the 'degenerate art' of the German Expressionists.
Would you have us cram the galleries full of paintings of the Madonna and Child, like in the good old days when the Church was dictating what should be painted?
You just haven't understood what I was trying to say. I wonder if you even tried. You noticed my nick, you read something about a certain criticism, not at all aimed at modern art as such but at the conmen trying to make a fortune by deliberately or non-deliberately deceiving people by producing rubbish they label modern art .... and look what is happening ..... Rwingo's mind starts a stampede ..... and look at the outcome ..... he equates me with Nazi-propaganda minister Joseph Goebbels and his tirades against "Entartete Kunst".
Rwrongo: "Would you have us cram the galleries full of paintings of the Madonna and Child, like in the good old days when the Church was dictating what should be painted?
The Church has always been and still is an initiater, supporter and advocate of the fine arts, including modern arts.
It is shocking to see what rancor and resentment can do to a man's reality conception.
Originally posted by ivanhoeYou're something else, Ivanhoe.
[b]Rwrongo: "You sound just like Goebbels railing on against the 'degenerate art' of the German Expressionists."
You just haven't understood what I was trying to say. I wonder if you even tried. You noticed my nick, you read something about a certain criticism, not at all aimed at modern art as such but at the conmen trying to make a fortune by deli ...[text shortened]... It is shocking to see what rancor and resentment can do to a man's reality conception.[/b]
So you like 'modern art', except the stuff that you (in your infinite wisdom) have labeled as "rubbish." I still fail to see how your tirade differs from Goebbels'. Art which you don't like is labeled as rubbish that is produced by deceptive conmen. You could practically be Goebbels' speech writer, for cryin' out loud.
Of course we know the standard drill about the Church: They never do bad, only good (repeat).
Originally posted by rwingettDo you deny there exists bad art or does quality not count in your section of the universe ?
You're something else, Ivanhoe.
So you like 'modern art', except the stuff that you (in your infinite wisdom) have labeled as "rubbish." I still fail to see how your tirade differs from Goebbels'. Art which you don't like is labeled as rubbish that is produced by deceptive conmen. You could practically be Goebbels' speech writer, for cryin' out loud.
...[text shortened]... rse we know the standard drill about the Church: They never do bad, only good (repeat).
By the way, could you please leave the Church out of this. It is a complete Red Herring on your part.
Originally posted by catfoodtimReading your post I get the impression you either have to like "traditional art" , whatever that is, or "modern art", whatever that is.
modern art gets a bad press. it is labelled everything from being pretentious posturing to sensation seeking.
i disagree. modern art reflects the culture and society that it emerges from. it challenges the contemporary art world and society until it is appropriated by the cultural elite and then becomes mainstream. then new artists emerge.
for ...[text shortened]... it is you don't like about modern art? what do you think is better with traditional art works?
One question to challenge the contemporary art world and society:
Do you think it is impossible for an artist to create "modern art" standing on the shoulders of "traditional artists" ?