@metal-brain saidYou used this article as a source on page 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_therapy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_therapy
It states in its first sentence:
"Gene therapy is a medical field which focuses on the genetic modification of cells to produce a therapeutic effect[1] or the treatment of disease by repairing or reconstructing defective genetic material.[2]"
Do you concede that the mRNA vaccines neither genetically modify cells nor repair or reconstruct genetic material?
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@no1marauder saidThat was not intended as a serious source of info. That was intended to mess with Shav the same way he does with me. Wikipedia is NOT a reliable source of information about controversial stuff.
You used this article as a source on page 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_therapy
It states in its first sentence:
"Gene therapy is a medical field which focuses on the genetic modification of cells to produce a therapeutic effect[1] or the treatment of disease by repairing or reconstructing defective genetic material.[2]"
Do you concede that the mRNA vaccines neither genetically modify cells nor repair or reconstruct genetic material?
My source is the FDA.
Why do you think mRNA vaccines are called "gene vaccines"?
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12667025/
"Do you concede that the mRNA vaccines neither genetically modify cells nor repair or reconstruct genetic material?"
That has not yet been factually established, but even if it was that is irrelevant. They do NOT have to. I have told you that several times and you refuse to accept it. I do not rely on ignorant people who self proclaim themselves as fact checkers. My source is the FDA!
Fact checkers do NOT represent facts. They are opinion pieces and nothing more. Stop parroting junk from opinion pieces.
From the link below:
"Gene therapy is a technique that modifies the expression of genes or alters biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes. This includes replacement, inactivation, or introduction of new genes. Introducing the gene therapy product into human cells requires a vector that will deliver the gene into the cells and incorporate those genes into the gene expression mechanism in those cells."
https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/biologics-research-projects/immunogenicity-gene-therapy-products
Notice this important part of that excerpt:
"or alters biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes."
I don't care how many fact checkers you saw on your internet search. They contradict the FDA. You all have a choice between believing a bunch of biased opinion pieces mislabeled as fact checkers or you can believe the FDA website.
The FDA is not a conspiracy website. If you have a problem with the FDA definition take it up with them.
@metal-brain saidThat abstract from a article, written in 2003, makes no mention of mRNA at all.
That was not intended as a serious source of info. That was intended to mess with Shav the same way he does with me. Wikipedia is NOT a reliable source of information about controversial stuff.
My source is the FDA.
Why do you think mRNA vaccines are called "gene vaccines"?
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12667025/
"Do you concede that the mRNA vaccines neither ...[text shortened]... represent facts. They are opinion pieces and nothing more. Stop parroting junk from opinion pieces.
Your source isn't the FDA but a bunch of crank articles.
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@metal-brain saidYou are truly functionally illiterate. The article you keep citing is from the Securities and Exchange Commission (HINT: sec.gov isn't the FDA) and is exactly what I said it was.
One more time:
mRNA vaccines do NOT have to integrate into your genome sequence to be gene therapy. You have a leap in faith in the self proclaimed fact checkers. They do NOT represent facts. They are merely opinion pieces.
I can call this a fact check too. Does that make it one?
NO PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICIAL SAYS the mRNA vaccines are not gene therapy. They are not ...[text shortened]... for stockholders"
That is a lie. Why would you claim something so stupid? It is the FDA website.
@no1marauder saidSo gene vaccines don't exist? You are really out on a limb. If it is a viral vector you are still wrong. 4 of the vaccines are viral vectors.
That abstract from a article, written in 2003, makes no mention of mRNA at all.
Your source isn't the FDA but a bunch of crank articles.
I will repeat again.
From the link below:
"Gene therapy is a technique that modifies the expression of genes or alters biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes. This includes replacement, inactivation, or introduction of new genes. Introducing the gene therapy product into human cells requires a vector that will deliver the gene into the cells and incorporate those genes into the gene expression mechanism in those cells."
https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/biologics-research-projects/immunogenicity-gene-therapy-products
Notice this important part of that excerpt:
"or alters biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes."
My source is the FDA. Lying is not a good tactic.
Either you believe the FDA or you don't. Which is it?
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@metal-brain saidThe mRNA vaccines don't "alter[] biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes."
From the link below:
"Gene therapy is a technique that modifies the expression of genes or alters biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes. This includes replacement, inactivation, or introduction of new genes. Introducing the gene therapy product into human cells requires a vector that will deliver the gene into the cells and incorporate thos ...[text shortened]... FDA is not a conspiracy website. If you have a problem with the FDA definition take it up with them.
They don't include "replacement, inactivation, or introduction of new genes."
Instead, they simply " teach our cells how to make a protein—or even just a piece of a protein—that triggers an immune response inside our bodies. That immune response, which produces antibodies, is what protects us from getting infected if the real virus enters our bodies."
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html
"Therapeutics" is "the branch of medicine that is concerned specifically with the treatment of disease."
https://www.rxlist.com/therapeutic/definition.htm
mRNA vaccines don't "treat" diseases.
@metal-brain saidLying isn't a good tactic.
So gene vaccines don't exist? You are really out on a limb. If it is a viral vector you are still wrong. 4 of the vaccines are viral vectors.
I will repeat again.
From the link below:
"Gene therapy is a technique that modifies the expression of genes or alters biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes. This includes replacement, inactivat ...[text shortened]... urce is the FDA. Lying is not a good tactic.
Either you believe the FDA or you don't. Which is it?
You should stop doing it.
@no1marauder saidYes they do. They alter the biological properties of cells.
The mRNA vaccines don't "alter[] biological properties of cells or tissues for therapeutic purposes."
They don't include "replacement, inactivation, or introduction of new genes."
They don't "requires a vector that will deliver the gene into the cells and incorporate those genes into the gene expression mechanism in those cells."
Instead, they simply " teach our ...[text shortened]... ease."
https://www.rxlist.com/therapeutic/definition.htm
mRNA vaccines don't "treat" diseases.
That is what artificial mRNA does. It alters your cells to produce an in vitro protein.
Call Captain Obvious.
mRNA treatments do treat disease. Cancer for example. Blood diseases. You are wrong. Look into the history of mRNA treatment. You have a lot to learn.
@no1marauder saidThat is not the FDA. BioNTech, duh!
You are truly functionally illiterate. The article you keep citing is from the Securities and Exchange Commission (HINT: sec.gov isn't the FDA) and is exactly what I said it was.
BioNTech made the statement that the FDA considers mRNA therapies gene therapy. That was the BioNTech filing with the SEC.
Get your facts straight.
@no1marauder saidYou are lying.
Lying isn't a good tactic.
You should stop doing it.
I posted this source and you lied and claimed it was not my source. STOP LYING!
https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/biologics-research-projects/immunogenicity-gene-therapy-products
@metal-brain saidNo, it doesn't. I suggest you have someone read this from the CDC for you. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html
Yes they do. They alter the biological properties of cells.
That is what artificial mRNA does. It alters your cells to produce an in vitro protein.
Call Captain Obvious.
mRNA treatments do treat disease. Cancer for example. Blood diseases. You are wrong. Look into the history of mRNA treatment. You have a lot to learn.
Adding a "piece of protein" to the surface of a cell does not alter its biological properties.
I said mRNA vaccines don't treat diseases and they don't. You are being dishonest to talk about other mRNA "treatments" that are not vaccines.
@metal-brain saidSeriously, GFY.
You are lying.
I posted this source and you lied and claimed it was not my source. STOP LYING!
https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/biologics-research-projects/immunogenicity-gene-therapy-products
You obviously cannot have a civil conversation because you are a deranged conspiracy nut. I addressed that source but you keep mentioning the SEC one as well as "proof" of what the FDA supposedly says.
Either adopt a civil tone or talk to yourself.
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@metal-brain saidI'm perfectly aware of that but you kept claiming that was the FDA saying it when it is, at best, a second hand claim made in a non-scientific document sent to stockholders. As such, it carries no weight.
That is not the FDA. BioNTech, duh!
BioNTech made the statement that the FDA considers mRNA therapies gene therapy. That was the BioNTech filing with the SEC.
Get your facts straight.
And the only mRNA treatments (not vaccines) it mentions are immunotherapy.
@no1marauder saidI said treatments, not vaccines. Notice the title of the thread. Does it say vaccine in it? Nope.
No, it doesn't. I suggest you have someone read this from the CDC for you. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html
Adding a "piece of protein" to the surface of a cell does not alter its biological properties.
I said mRNA vaccines don't treat diseases and they don't. You are being dishonest to talk about other mRNA "treatments" that are not vaccines.
mRNA started out as a treatment. Look into the history of mRNA technology. You have a lot to learn.
"Adding a "piece of protein" to the surface of a cell does not alter its biological properties."
That is just a stupid statement. Your cell was altered to add that protein via mRNA. You know it too. You are resorting to nonsensical arguments now. Give it up. Your desperation is evident to all.