24 Sep 07
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5296200.stm
“Very obese women should be denied fertility treatment”
“Being overweight can put both the health of the mother and child at risk through problems such as gestational diabetes and high blood pressure.”
Question is: Since this avoids additional costs to NHS due to complications, could the next logical step (in the name of fairness to all) be to force all obese women who conceive to abort? Otherwise benefits will be denied to avoid those same additional costs.
24 Sep 07
Originally posted by MacSwainHow about use the money saved to help the women lose weight? This would save even more money for the penny-pinching NHS in the long term. The NHS spend time and money on helping people stop smoking, drug taking and drinking, so they should put some resources into this too. 🙂
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5296200.stm
“Very obese women should be denied fertility treatment”
“Being overweight can put both the health of the mother and child at risk through problems such as gestational diabetes and high blood pressure.”
Question is: Since this avoids additional costs to NHS due to complications, could the next logical s ...[text shortened]... n who conceive to abort? Otherwise benefits will be denied to avoid those same additional costs.
24 Sep 07
Originally posted by Pawn Qweenthey do - anyone severely overweight should be offered access to a dietician by their GP, and to a physical exersize instructor too. There are even areas where free gym memnerships are given out to help people lose weight. Why did you think the NHS didn't apply any reasources to this area?
The NHS spend time and money on helping people stop smoking, drug taking and drinking, so they should put some resources into [obesity] too. 🙂
24 Sep 07
Originally posted by MacSwainthe same difference as being allowed to withdraw treatment that'll mean someone dies, but not being allowed to give them an overdose to kill them. Or that it's OK to give a drug to help someone's pain that will shorten their life, but it's not OK to set out to shorten someones life with a painkilling drug.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5296200.stm
Question is: Since this avoids additional costs to NHS due to complications, could the next logical step (in the name of fairness to all) be to force all obese women who conceive to abort? Otherwise benefits will be denied to avoid those same additional costs.
The difference is clearly that, whereas it a womans right to get pregnant even if it will endanger her life, but it is unethical for the medical profession to actively endanger a patients life (unless inactivity would be a greater danger/loss to quality of life).
Basically, this is the same as you last case - the NHS won't give treatments that're likely to make the patient medically worse off.
24 Sep 07
I have no problem whatsoever with the idea that patients must look after themselves to enable treatment to work - it's called a social contract, and it
implies responsibility on both sides.
I don't think compulsory abortion is ever going to happen. This isn't an authoritarian measure, it's about managing risk.
24 Sep 07
Originally posted by MacSwainThis is why there needs to be a free market. Let the really rich fat women spend their money. Let's get it back into circulation through means other than ice cream shops and brownie bars.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5296200.stm
“Very obese women should be denied fertility treatment”
“Being overweight can put both the health of the mother and child at risk through problems such as gestational diabetes and high blood pressure.”
Question is: Since this avoids additional costs to NHS due to complications, could the next logical s ...[text shortened]... n who conceive to abort? Otherwise benefits will be denied to avoid those same additional costs.
25 Sep 07
Originally posted by MacSwainIt's a way to save money and nothing more. NHS is already expensive enough. The next step, I would think, is to deny fertility treatment to all. THis would remove the additional expense from complications that even "healthy" women have sometimes as well as the expense of the birth itself.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5296200.stm
“Very obese women should be denied fertility treatment”
“Being overweight can put both the health of the mother and child at risk through problems such as gestational diabetes and high blood pressure.”
Question is: Since this avoids additional costs to NHS due to complications, could the next logical s ...[text shortened]... n who conceive to abort? Otherwise benefits will be denied to avoid those same additional costs.
"If you think healthcare is expensive now, wait until it's free!"
- P.J. O'rourke.
25 Sep 07
Originally posted by belgianfreakStrangely enough, the answer to your question is in todays news. Health cuts by certain NHS trusts mean that patients in certain areas aren't receiving the treatments that they need to become healthier people. Where it could be a case of prevention being cheaper than cure, it's maybe even cheaper to just let them die.
they do - anyone severely overweight should be offered access to a dietician by their GP, and to a physical exersize instructor too. There are even areas where free gym memnerships are given out to help people lose weight. Why did you think the NHS didn't apply any reasources to this area?
27 Sep 07
Originally posted by AmauroteIs this the contract you mean?
I have no problem whatsoever with the idea that patients must look after themselves to enable treatment to work - it's called a social contract, and it
implies responsibility on both sides.
I don't think compulsory abortion is ever going to happen. This isn't an authoritarian measure, it's about managing risk.
http://www.worldtrans.org/sov/soccont.html
I sure as hell don't remember signing it.
27 Sep 07
1 edit
Originally posted by MacSwainStop regulating health care. Let the women pay for fertility treatments or weight loss treatment or whatever they like. It is only the government's business how fat I am or whether or not I have kids because we ASKED them to pay for it. Asking any third party to pay jacks up the cost -- it has to.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/5296200.stm
“Very obese women should be denied fertility treatment”
“Being overweight can put both the health of the mother and child at risk through problems such as gestational diabetes and high blood pressure.”
Question is: Since this avoids additional costs to NHS due to complications, could the next logical s ...[text shortened]... n who conceive to abort? Otherwise benefits will be denied to avoid those same additional costs.
Take the government out of the loop. Insure yourself against accidents -- not against random but inevitable and non-life-threatening events like warts or getting a cold from time to time.
The market for health care has been screwed. A few groups are making a mint, and the rest of us are lining up to get the high-priced scraps that are reluctantly doled out by health services as recommended by their staff of health economists.
P.S. Health care is expensive because it is artifically made scarce and non-competitive 'for our own good'.
27 Sep 07
Originally posted by Pawn QweenUse tax money to bribe fat people to lose weight?
How about use the money saved to help the women lose weight? This would save even more money for the penny-pinching NHS in the long term. The NHS spend time and money on helping people stop smoking, drug taking and drinking, so they should put some resources into this too. 🙂
I think the money would be better used to create legislation against industries who's business objective is to get the human population addicted to dangerous foods from a young age.
I would like to see some laws against McDonalds/PepsiCo's marketing campaigns targeting ages 5-8 year olds.
There's lots of laws defending Industry against everything, I think it's time to re-invent laws defending Individuals against Industry.
For that matter, I would also like to see laws targeting things that encourage sleep-deprivation. That probably sounds totally out there right now, because we are all addicted to television, but can you imagine a world where private companies were not allowed to work employees over 30 hours and night time was legally protected as the best time for humans to sleep?