20 May 08
1 edit
Man, this guy must WANT a Republican in the White House! He's said some boneheaded things, but that quote out of Oregon today? That sealed it. He announced that the rest of the world was not going to just "keep saying it's okay" for us (Americans) to drive our SUV's, eat all we want, and keep our thermostats set at 72 all the time.
1. Just who does he think he is to tell us what to drive, how much we should eat,and what temp to keep our homes set?
2. What does the "rest of the world" have to do with it? Does he care what they say or think? Does he think WE care what they say or think?
3. Democrats, I was taught, were for the common working-class citizens--Joe & Jane SixPack. But I see nothing but an effete elitist in this jerk. Once again, the party "of the people" has feet of clay.
20 May 08
Originally posted by PinkFloydPersonally, I am unimpressed by Obama, I wouldn't support him if I were American, and you may well be right when you dub him 'an effete elitist'. Nor have I read the quote you are referring to. But having said that I feel pretty sure that you must have got the wrong end of the stick.
He announced that the rest of the world was not going to just "keep saying it's okay" for us (Americans) to drive our SUV's, eat all we want, and keep our thermostats set at 72 all the time. 1. Just who does he think he is to tell us what to drive, how much we should eat,and what temp to keep our homes set? 2. What does the "rest of the world" have to do with it?
The growing economies of China and India require more and more oil, for example. The USA is either going to have to change its own consumption rates or try to pro-actively deprive these competitors of their access to oil. Some say that's what this current 'stand-off' with Iran is really all about. It'd make sense. The USA needs a disproportionate amount of the world's remaining oil to enable you Americans to 'run your SUV's and keep your thermostats set at 72 all the time'.
Far be it from me to speak on Obama's behalf, but isn't it just possible that his "the world was not going to just 'keep saying it's okay'" comment was a euphemistic reference to the World Wars of the future, fought over limited resources (not just oil, but over water, and perhaps food too)? If i were American, that's what his comment would have meant to me.
20 May 08
Originally posted by FMFI see your point. And if that was his meaning, he was still speaking in a deferrential way regarding "the rest of the world", and I find that insulting and craven, It's as though he was sniveling "We can't have the rest of the world mad at us, or "Not Okay" with us". I don't want another world war, but my point is still "So what if they're not okay with our consumption?" Unless we turn into the bad guys and start taking resources by force from other nations (which I find ridiculous), then I don't see a problem. If someone has the means, they can and should buy whatever vehicle, and however much of Obama;s $200 ham, they desire. I personally find 72 to be way too hot, so my thermostat's on 68 in summer and 78 in winter. This should be just fine with our global neighbors as long as we pay for it fair and square.
Far be it from me to speak on Obama's behalf, but isn't it just possible that his "the world was not going to just 'keep saying it's okay'" comment was a euphemistic reference to the World Wars of the future, fought over limited resources (not just oil, but over water, and perhaps food too)? If i were American, that's what his comment would have meant to me.[/b]
20 May 08
Originally posted by PinkFloydNot being American, I do not feel in my heart that his turn of phrase was "insulting and craven". I sympathize with you, while at the same time not quite understanding what the substance of the "insult" is. Was it not simply a take on reality? The language of political discourse varies so much around the world. In some places people are not free to say what may need to be said. Even if they wrap it up in a euphemism.
Unless we turn into the bad guys and start taking resources by force from other nations (which I find ridiculous), then I don't see a problem. [...] This should be just fine with our global neighbors as long as we pay for it fair and square.
I suppose one response to what you're saying would be to ask you if "pay for it fair and square" is another euphemism? If, say - for the sake of argument - Iran were currently selling all its oil to China. How would the U.S. be able to 'pay for that oil fair and square'? It simply wouldn't be getting it, surely? Take Iraq: before the 2003 U.S. invasion, almost none of Iraq's oil was ending up in the U.S. Now, in 2008, the Americans effectively have control of it. Would you say that this turn of events is an example of the U.S. 'paying for it fair and square'?
20 May 08
Originally posted by PinkFloydBRAVISIMO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Man, this guy must WANT a Republican in the White House! He's said some boneheaded things, but that quote out of Oregon today? That sealed it. He announced that the rest of the world was not going to just "keep saying it's okay" for us (Americans) to drive our SUV's, eat all we want, and keep our thermostats set at 72 all the time.
1. Just who does ...[text shortened]... effete elitist in this jerk. Once again, the party "of the people" has feet of clay.
20 May 08
Originally posted by FMFThe "reality" is that the United States is sovereign nation not beholden to "the rest of the word," the opinions of the EU, nor the U.N.
Not being American, I do not feel in my heart that his turn of phrase was "insulting and craven". I sympathize with you, while at the same time not quite understanding what the substance of the "insult" is. Was it not simply a take on reality? The language of political discourse varies so much around the world. In some places people are not free to say what may ...[text shortened]... that this turn of events is an example of the U.S. 'paying for it fair and square'?
20 May 08
1 edit
Originally posted by PinkFloydWell we (the rest of the world) are starting to get more power and influence internationally and if we don't like what we see in the US we might do something about it. You may not care, but it will affect you wither you like it or not.
It's as though he was sniveling "We can't have the rest of the world mad at us, or "Not Okay" with us". I don't want another world war, but my point is still "So what if they're not okay with our consumption?"
Unless we turn into the bad guys and start taking resources by force from other nations (which I find ridiculous),
But you already are the 'bad guys' and already do take resources by force from other nations. And I don't mean just via war as you did with Iraq. Economic strong arming is just as forceful as military methods.
This should be just fine with our global neighbors as long as we pay for it fair and square.
Which you never have. There is nothing fair about international trade and never has been.
You will change your tune when the Chinese have the upper hand (which they will soon).
20 May 08
Originally posted by PinkFloydAmazingly, we agree. When I heard that Obama had said this my first thought was ... its Big Brother talking.
Man, this guy must WANT a Republican in the White House! He's said some boneheaded things, but that quote out of Oregon today? That sealed it. He announced that the rest of the world was not going to just "keep saying it's okay" for us (Americans) to drive our SUV's, eat all we want, and keep our thermostats set at 72 all the time.
1. Just who does ...[text shortened]... effete elitist in this jerk. Once again, the party "of the people" has feet of clay.
I guess we have to take into account who he was speaking to... a bunch of aging hippies/envirowhackos in Oregon. I'm sure it got a huge round of applause from them
20 May 08
Originally posted by der schwarze RitterFMF the Ritter has stated it much better than I, in much fewer words. Obama seems to think we must have the approval of other nations and/or the UN--for anything; I respectfully disagree.
The "reality" is that the United States is sovereign nation not beholden to "the rest of the word," the opinions of the EU, nor the U.N.
20 May 08
Originally posted by PinkFloydAn actual link to a specific quote would be nice.
Man, this guy must WANT a Republican in the White House! He's said some boneheaded things, but that quote out of Oregon today? That sealed it. He announced that the rest of the world was not going to just "keep saying it's okay" for us (Americans) to drive our SUV's, eat all we want, and keep our thermostats set at 72 all the time.
1. Just who does ...[text shortened]... effete elitist in this jerk. Once again, the party "of the people" has feet of clay.
20 May 08
1 edit
Originally posted by der schwarze RitterYES IT IS...however it does poke its nose in every other countries business.
The "reality" is that the United States is sovereign nation not beholden to "the rest of the word," the opinions of the EU, nor the U.N.
you should pratice what you preach