Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 00:245 edits
    It's downright Orwellian how the term "orwellian" is being misused of late.

    DT Jr. says that “we are living Orwell’s 1984. Free-speech no longer exists in America. It died with big tech and what’s left is only there for a chosen few.” Nevermind the fact that he has an entire White House press corp and can go on Foxnews whenever he asks, or put their message out through any number of a wide variety of news sources.

    But is a Twitter ban Orwellian? Setting aside the dubious notion that DT Jr. has ever even read 1984, that book is a cautionary tale on totalitarian and dystopian societies, how a government can undermine and surveil free thought, people’s movements and opportunities, create false narratives, and ultimately create an alternate reality for their citizens. A good example of "Orwellian" might be a political party in power starts calling a free and fair election "fake news" and getting millions of people to believe it in the absence of concrete evidence.

    And yet a sitting US senator calls it Orwellian when his book deal gets cancelled. No joke, I received a holiday card in the mail this year saying a city-wide mask mandate was "straight out of Orwell's 1984."

    Is the term "orwellian" being used in an Orwellian sense, as in, in a way that purposefully distorts reality? Or are people using this term who either haven't read the book or don't understand it?
  2. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 00:36
    @wildgrass
    Would it be Orwellian if the political party in power claim the elections were honest free elections, even though they were rigged?
  3. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 00:451 edit
    @eladar said
    @wildgrass
    Would it be Orwellian if the political party in power claim the elections were honest free elections, even though they were rigged?
    Rigged is so exquisitely nondescript. Just like when libs say our society is "unfair." What version of the rigged narrative are you referring to? The Emmy's being 'rigged' against The Apprentice TV show?
  4. Subscriberlemondrop
    pawn grabber
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    14 Jan '21 01:02
    words are funny things
  5. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 01:25
    @wildgrass
    Rigged means simply falsely counted. As Putin said, it is not the people who vote that decide elections, it is the people who count the votes that decide elections.

    Is it your opinion that simply because there is no evidence of foul play, that means there was no foul play?

    Especially when politically appointed judges decide what is evidence and what is not?
  6. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 01:59
    @eladar said
    @wildgrass
    Rigged means simply falsely counted. As Putin said, it is not the people who vote that decide elections, it is the people who count the votes that decide elections.

    Is it your opinion that simply because there is no evidence of foul play, that means there was no foul play?

    Especially when politically appointed judges decide what is evidence and what is not?
    Right. By what heresy do you need evidence as a prerequisite for making conclusions? That definitely would be Orwellian.

    I believe the quote is: “For, after all, how do we know that two and two make four? Or that the force of gravity works? Or that the past is unchangeable? If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable – what then?” ― George Orwell
  7. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 02:00
    @lemondrop said
    words are funny things
    “It's a beautiful thing, the destruction of words.” ― George Orwell
  8. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 02:00
    @eladar said
    @wildgrass
    Would it be Orwellian if the political party in power claim the elections were honest free elections, even though they were rigged?
    How bout them antithetical Dems....Orwell was a seer, although I think he missed Cancel Culture. If I were him I’m sure I would have seen it coming. Free speech was fine until Trump became president. Free speech for Dems was great until they made their point, but now there will never be free speech again. Free speech was over after they’ve made their point, Using It.
    Libs think free speech is OK as long as it doesn’t offend them. I am an optimist and think your movements will give rise to new ‘platforms’ that may help the entire country wrench itself back to reality. But alas., the 3 branches of govt together may beat us into submission . Did you libs ever think that our party made you feel that way when we were in control..? No, indeed, we encouraged the dependent libs to prosper, be independent, make something of their lives. Pre COVID, Donald had SEVEN MILLION jobs there for the taking. Remember that flickering flame in the years to come.. sincerely, AvJoe
  9. Subscribermedullah
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    14 Jan '21 02:02

    Removed by poster

  10. Subscribermedullah
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    14 Jan '21 02:04
    @AverageJoe1

    The winds of change migth be starting to gather.

    If you can access Parlay Trump has confirmed that he has invoked The Insurrection Act.
  11. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 02:131 edit
    @medullah said
    @AverageJoe1

    The winds of change migth be starting to gather.

    If you can access Parlay Trump has confirmed that he has invoked The Insurrection Act.
    I think Trump era is over. Do you think there is more? We are seeing something bigger than Trump. Bigger even than that Stacy Abrams, That is big.
    Let’s quit writing Trump Trump...... we have huge fish to fry....like Stacy. AOC is only one of these culture people. I have said for ten years it is about culture, not race. Just a glance at Biden cabinet should be a hint,,,,although he has nothing to do with this Cabinet.
  12. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 02:17
    @averagejoe1 said
    How bout them antithetical Dems....Orwell was a seer, although I think he missed Cancel Culture. If I were him I’m sure I would have seen it coming. Free speech was fine until Trump became president. Free speech for Dems was great until they made their point, but now there will never be free speech again. Free speech was over after they’ve made their point, Using It.
    ...[text shortened]... bs there for the taking. Remember that flickering flame in the years to come.. sincerely, AvJoe
    Orwell didn't miss cancel culture, he just didn't frame it in the 'lost my social media account' or the 'lost my book deal, boo hoo' sense proffered by bum hurt conservatives forced to live with their actions' consequences. The Newspeak ("groupthink"😉 is framed in the absence of context or reality and that is similar to the way cancel culture operates. Counter narratives persist everywhere in our society, unlike what Orwell describes. I'm sorry Senator Hawley, you'll have to find someone else to publish your book. In the meantime, you have as much time as you need to convey your message livestreamed on the Senate floor every darn day. 1st amendment rights?
  13. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 02:53
    @wildgrass
    Right, so hearsay evidence can never be true.
  14. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 03:33
    @eladar said
    @wildgrass
    Right, so hearsay evidence can never be true.
    I mean, anything's possible. How can you ever really know anything? In the end, 2+2 equals whatever makes you happy.
  15. Joined
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    14 Jan '21 08:51
    @wildgrass said
    Orwell didn't miss cancel culture, he just didn't frame it in the 'lost my social media account' or the 'lost my book deal, boo hoo' sense proffered by bum hurt conservatives forced to live with their actions' consequences. The Newspeak ("groupthink"😉 is framed in the absence of context or reality and that is similar to the way cancel culture operates. Counter narratives pe ...[text shortened]... u need to convey your message livestreamed on the Senate floor every darn day. 1st amendment rights?
    You have no idea how bad it is.

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/w79RsPEIaNvw/
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