Is that "The World Is Better Off Without Saddam"
then "But... it was wrong to remove him."
Think of it. A real miracle. Two supposedly true statements that are mutually exclusive.
Which is it?
It can't be both. That would be a miracle. This miracle can best be said as "The Removal Of Saddam Didn't Require The War"
I call it the "Removal" miracle. Most lefties believe in it.
Using logic, first state:
1 - If you believe the world is better off without Saddam. This is where lefties and relativism usually fails. Just pretend that there is such a thing as "yes and no" but not "maybe".
2 - If you answer "No" to (1) above, then you are free to hate the US and the war.
3 - If you answer "Yes" to (1) above, then you support Bush and the war, ipso facto, that force (Bush and War) removed Saddam.
What say you, lefties? I would be interested in seeing you support the terrorists over the people of Iraq as demonstrated for the world last Sunday.
Ok.
Based on the response to this thread, I'm assuming that nobody is willing to argue the logic of the Miracle.
But maybe other Lefties are not logged on right now. I'll keep this up front for a week or two, just so all left wing whacko's can refute it. Or not.
If "or not", then be warned... every time you go against Bush and/or the War, I'm going to accuse you of superstitious behaviour, ie, believing in "the miracle".
yes the world is better off without saddam, but that doesn't mean it was worth a war to get rid of him. I don't think he was important enough to justify the thousands of deaths and foreign entanglement, or the billions of dollars of taxpayer money. Not to mention becoming more hated throughout the world. There are some things that aren't worth the trouble, such as conservatives. They may be wrong be wrong, but it isn't worth the time of anyone with a life to refute them on an internet chess server.
I really didn't try to be mean, it was just a good joke, and I couldn't let the opportunity pass. 😀 And I do like to debate politics but you'll find I'm not very knowledgeable or skilled in this regard.
Originally posted by StarValleyWyThis 'Leftie' is not about to get into another argument with you. You may well be right in some way or another, it is a contradiction. If i thought you'd listen i might try and explain why it isn't, but experience dictates that your HATE is all consumming and is better left ignorred.
Ok.
Based on the response to this thread, I'm assuming that nobody is willing to argue the logic of the Miracle.
But maybe other Lefties are not logged on right now. I'll keep this up front for a week or two, just so all left wing whacko's can refute it. Or not.
If "or not", then be warned... every time you go against Bush and/or the War, I'm going to accuse you of superstitious behaviour, ie, believing in "the miracle".
Originally posted by ark13Yes, but
yes the world is better off without saddam, but that doesn't mean it was worth a war to get rid of him. I don't think he was important enough to justify the thousands of deaths and foreign entanglement, or the billions of dollars of taxpayer money. Not to mention becoming more hated throughout the world. There are some things that aren't worth the trouble ...[text shortened]... like to debate politics but you'll find I'm not very knowledgeable or skilled in this regard.
See. You believe in miracles. You really mean no. True?
Remember the rules. There are no miracles. Is the world better off or not? Can't be both. That is a miracle. Yes or No?
Originally posted by marinakatombMy hate of miracles is quite strong. I am sorry if you feel I hate "you" as a being. I don't even know you, so that in itself would constitute another miracle. What I "Hate" is the utter disregard for logic that allows all religion to flurish. The miracle is just an example to lefties to point out that they use "religion" in the same way as RBHill. Their religion just isn't christianity. But it is just as silly.
This 'Leftie' is not about to get into another argument with you. You may well be right in some way or another, it is a contradiction. If i thought you'd listen i might try and explain why it isn't, but experience dictates that your HATE is all consumming and is better left ignorred.
Yes or no? Would Saddam have been removed without Bush?
Ok. Binary is called for here.
True - False
There are certain things in the world that are Binary.
Saddam is either "in charge" or "not in charge."
I know that all you lefties want to use the "But" clause to weisel out of answering. This has to be painful for you.
Is or isn't.
binary.
Or explain how saddam can be "in charge and not in charge" at the same time. That is your "But". It is not real. It is your religion showing through.
Originally posted by StarValleyWyNo, he wouldn't have been removed by any outside power like the UN or anything. It is hard to say for definate that his removal is better than leaving him in place. Ever heard the saying 'Better the devil you know than the one you don't' ??
My hate of miracles is quite strong. I am sorry if you feel I hate "you" as a being. I don't even know you, so that in itself would constitute another miracle. What I "Hate" is the utter disregard for logic that allows all religion to flurish. The miracle is just an example to lefties to point out that they use "religion" in the same way as RBHil ...[text shortened]... hristianity. But it is just as silly.
Yes or no? Would Saddam have been removed without Bush?
The reason i have mixed feelings (ie, im glad Saddam is gone but don't like the way it was done) is because by one country deciding a Leader of another country is not fit to lead based on their own moral logic, it opens up the flood gates for any country to judge another ethically. This is something i cannot agree with as i am a moral reletivist. I believe a country develops it's own set of ethics based on the collective contiousness of it's people. When compairing countries and the practicise of it's peoples, one can't sit back in judgement. As an observer we can't sit back in neutrality, we all come from an ethical system ourselves and therefore always lean towards our own interpretation of right and wrong.
When talking about bringing freedom to a country, it has to be realized that that countries occupants must actively want it. Looking at the American war of independance, you yanks WANTED Liberty and were willing to fight for it. That is how America became the land of the free. The Vietnamese on the other hand didn't want American freedom. Their own ethical and philisophical aproach combined with the economic situation mean't the inhabitants favoured Communism.
To stand back and try to find which one was right, is pointless. When talking about whether the US was right or wrong to invade Iraq, i find i have two answers. Yes and No.
Originally posted by marinakatombMarin.
No, he wouldn't have been removed by any outside power like the UN or anything. It is hard to say for definate that his removal is better than leaving him in place. Ever heard the saying 'Better the devil you know than the one you do ...[text shortened]... or wrong to invade Iraq, i find i have two answers. Yes and No.
Sigh.
Yes or no? Before we go on. Answer the question. I ain't even going to read your blather until you recognize the basis of the thread. See the first post. Yes -- NO
Binary. Who cares how you "feel". Yes or no? World better off without Saddam. Miracles. There is a cause to every eventuality.
Originally posted by StarValleyWyYes or no? Would Saddam have been removed without Bush?
Marin.
Sigh.
Yes or no? Before we go on. Answer the question. I ain't even going to read your blather until you recognize the basis of the thread. See the first post. Yes -- NO
Binary. Who cares how you "feel". Yes or no? World better off without Saddam. Miracles. There is a cause to every eventuality.
I said...'No, Saddam would not have been removed by the UN or anyone like that...'
Ok. Now bend a little from your need to get me to agree with you totally and completely and think about what i said.
Originally posted by marinakatombIs the world -- more specifically, the Iraqi nation -- better off without Saddam?
Yes or no? Would Saddam have been removed without Bush?
I said...'No, Saddam would not have been removed by the UN or anyone like that...'
Ok. Now bend a little from your need to get me to agree with you totally and completely and think about what i said.
Yes or no?
See, you are taking this as personal. It is not. I just want people to realize that they are being very "RBHill"esque when they oppose the liberation of Iraq.
Sure you hate the US. That's ok. Irrational, but Ok.
Just don't continue to support the terrorists by insisting that the war to kill them is not a just war.
Originally posted by StarValleyWyI don't know. I never lived under Saddam and i certainly don't live in Iraq right now. I would like to think that in time democracy will prevail and the Iraqi people will enjoy the freedom as they have been promised but that is far from certain at the moment.
Is the world -- more specifically, the Iraqi nation -- better off without Saddam?
Yes or no?
Originally posted by marinakatombOk. I did. You seem to need to apologize for supporting terror?
Ok. Now bend a little from your need to get me to agree with you totally and completely and think about what i said.
What? I have no clue what you said. It seemed to be that
"Saddam is gone. Good. He was removed without my approval. Bad."
What am I missing here?
Originally posted by StarValleyWyThis is untrue. I don't know what propoganda you've been listening to but this is completely false. As a free person i retain the right to disagree with the US, but there is no hate there at all.
Sure you hate the US. That's ok. Irrational, but Ok.
Just don't continue to support the terrorists by insisting that the war to kill them is not a just war.
Originally posted by marinakatombYou didn't learn anything from watching millions of people stain their finger... marking them for death -- in order to vote to be free of slavery and terror?
I don't know. I never lived under Saddam and i certainly don't live in Iraq right now. I would like to think that in time democracy will prevail and the Iraqi people will enjoy the freedom as they have been promised but that is far from certain at the moment.
What will it take to make an impression on you then?