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Tony Blair out of touch with Britain today?

Tony Blair out of touch with Britain today?

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H

Devon

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I for one am fed up with the Labour party today. For many reasons, probably exaustively disscussed before on other political channels, the labour party is increasingly detatching itself from modern Britain. I think now that it has now detatched itself from a large proportion of the population now that it now does not represent a democratic representative of this country.

On several issues, which i could go into and discuss$, for which i do not have enough space to go into and further my message at this moment

On the issue of higher education, as a student, i would criticise Labour for raising the tuition fees by ~300%. I do not see how this would encourage young people from deprived backgrounds to go to study at university, even with government funding! What we would be creating is a society with a lower class dependent on state benefits, not willing to work their way up in society. Trust me, i have met people in pubs proud to have failed their GCSE's and living off the state. Frankly it pisses me off! We are ever as a country becoming dependent on foreign employees to work in services such as the NHS. The government should do more to encouragée OUR young to study and help our own country.

I would be interested to hear from people of both sides of my argument, especially on how the government could improve its public relations, including the hunting bill, iraq, and internal affairs like Blunkett! On seeing the performance seen already be Labour in government, is it now time to elect another government?

hjp

t

Australia

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Originally posted by hjp
I for one am fed up with the Labour party today. For many reasons, probably exaustively disscussed before on other political channels, the labour party is increasingly detatching itself from modern Britain. I think now that it has now detatched itself from a large proportion of the population now that it now does not represent a democratic representative of this ...[text shortened]... ormance seen already be Labour in government, is it now time to elect another government?

hjp
I left the UK years ago and when i went to Uni there were no fees...... how much does it cost to do a degree now? Just curious as about to start a degree in Oz and would like to compare prices?

Also hate dole bulgers, government needs to toughen up and give less hand outs........ force the scroungers to work for a living. In my view there are no excuses for laziness, I've known many people who under far more adverse conditions then some of those bulgers, have made a successful life.

b

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Spent a few years in the UK, I don't know how well TB will do in the upconing election, seems to have really lost his aims and ideals he started out with, seems to be a Tory in labour guise more and more.

Main interests seem to be: Helping big business and preserving the relationship with the US.

Next elections should be interesting.

s
Red Republican

Auckland

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Originally posted by timebombted
I left the UK years ago and when i went to Uni there were no fees...... how much does it cost to do a degree now? Just curious as about to start a degree in Oz and would like to compare prices?

Also hate dole bulgers, government needs to toughen up and give less hand outs........ force the scroungers to work for a living. In my view there are no excus ...[text shortened]... e who under far more adverse conditions then some of those bulgers, have made a successful life.
Tell me - do you see any irony in telling us in the first paragraph you paid nothing for your university education - and in the second, whining about bludgers and scroungers?

R
Godless Commie

Glasgow

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Blair is likely to win the next UK election. This won't be because he is in any way popular, it is just that the Tories are so useless and inept. Blair will win by default - the alternative just isn't an option.
I'll be interested to see how the LibDems and Respect do in England, how people like Forward Wales do, and of course how the Scottish Socialists do. There's a real need for parties of the left to put forward sensible policies - no more of this 'the market is king' nonsense. If these alternative parties grow up on a national rather than UK level, then that's fine by me.

I don't think its just Labour who have lost touch with the British people, I think both parties have - and the Tories had less contact with ordinary people in the 1st place. I think the entire political 'establishment' has lost touch with the people.

b

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Having been to a few of the anti-war rallies in London, it seems the lefts greatest enemy is itself.

SO many splinter groups sitting and bickering among themselves just disillusion people. If they united they would share amuch larger proportion of the votes.

R
Godless Commie

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Originally posted by builder
Having been to a few of the anti-war rallies in London, it seems the lefts greatest enemy is itself.

SO many splinter groups sitting and bickering among themselves just disillusion people. If they united they would share amuch larger proportion of the votes.
I agree - that's exactly what we've done in Scotland with the SSP.
A single left voice - there's still plenty of discussion and debate (and some bickering) internally, but we agree a common policy platform and stick to it.
The "people's front of Judea" scenes from Life of Brian sums it up.

b

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Brilliant movie, sums it all up.

invigorate
Only 1 F in Uckfield

Buxted UK

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Originally posted by builder
Brilliant movie, sums it all up.
Labour will win the next election because they are working. Low unemployment, lower class sizes, lower crime, low interest rates, stable economic growth balanced with good social justice.

Students should pay for their something towards education, the NHS should be competitive, we should tax fuel cigarettes and alcohol.

I just wish they could match this social justice internally without acting like bush's lap dog internationally.

R
Godless Commie

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Originally posted by invigorate
Labour will win the next election because they are working. Low unemployment, lower class sizes, lower crime, low interest rates, stable economic growth balanced with good social justice.

Students should pay for their something towards education, the NHS should be competitive, we should tax fuel cigarettes and alcohol.

I just wish they could match this social justice internally without acting like bush's lap dog internationally.
Where to start.......
Low unemplyment is mainly a global economic feature. Sure, New Labour didn't deliberately stoke high unemplyement for ideological reasons like Thatcher, but they don't get the credit for it being low. Ditto lower interest rates
Lower crime - depends which stats you look at.
Class sizes - maybe, but I'd rather it was trained teachers in front of the kids.
Good social justice - really? I guess it depends what you expect. I'm not happy with some tinkering around the edges of 'family-friendly' policies and tweaking the benefits system.

Students do pay something towards their education. I got a degree 20-odd years ago. I paid no fees and got a full grant (about £2k per year). I've been paying that back in taxes since. We need educated people for the good of society as a whole, so we should all pay for that education.

The NHS should be competetive. What does this mean? Exactly what should the NHS compete with? Sounds like market-oriented mumbo-jumbo to me.

H

Devon

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...... how much does it cost to do a degree now?
At the moment i am paying £1100 in tuition fees, in excess of £3100 for accomodation, and whatever left for food, bills, hobbies etc. I'm currently receiving a loan from my council of £4000 a year, which i'll have to pay back with interest when i start earning. i will probably have a debt of about £15000 by the time i graduate, and if i carry on to do postgraduate studies then that will increase even further. As tuition fees are going up then students in the future are going to leave university with crippling debts of £20k+. And thats just for a normal undergrad degree, which nowadays doesnt count for much in the job market today.

And people argue that the govt should not assist students in higher education, yet in the end it is they, the population as a whole and the economy that will benefit from a well educated workforce. There is the age-old argument that when the dustman suffers a heartattack, it will be the doctor who will probably save his life.

Also by giving people such large debts, it will just store up trouble for the future. Blair's plan of having half the population in higher education, give them a load of debt and its just going to cause problems. I'm not an economist but it kinda makes sense.

invigorate
Only 1 F in Uckfield

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Don't get me wrong - students should not have too pay for their education - but some contribution to cost is necessary. Otherwise they will do what I did drink and shag my way through four years at the taxpayers expense!

R
Godless Commie

Glasgow

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Originally posted by invigorate
Don't get me wrong - students should not have too pay for their education - but some contribution to cost is necessary. Otherwise they will do what I did drink and shag my way through four years at the taxpayers expense!
Sounds not dis-similar to my experience, with a degree thrown in as well.
The point is, though, that because of that degree, I can contribute more to society and the economy than I otherwise would. Therefore it is in everyone's interests to have enough people suitably educated. Therefore everyone should bear the cost.
Not rocket science (I failed rocket science anyway).

S
Bah Humbug!

C:\Drive

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Originally posted by invigorate

Students should pay for their something towards education, the NHS should be competitive, we should tax fuel cigarettes and alcohol.
In Britain, taxes on fuel, cigarettes and alcohol are already amongst the highest in the world. There isn't much margin left to milk these cash cows any further.


On a general note, I agree with Redmike that Labour will win through default. Who would want Michael Howard as PM? Politicians as a whole have become some of the most despised members of British society regardless of party. The great majority of them are nothing more than self serving opportuninsts with agendas that concentrate purely on PR and spin in order to get themselves a mandate.
Tony Blair may win only because he is seen as the best of a rotten bunch.

WA
TruthLogicReason

Nirvana

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By the peolpe, for the people is a myth!

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