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@shavixmir saidYou said it yourself:
Cheerful news from the Netherlands. Some numbers for ye to crunch:
83.5% of the population vaccinated.
75% of hospitalisations are unvaccinated people.
80% of IC admittance are unvaccinated.
The number of IC beds being used for corona is increasly fast. Which as people should know is a problem: the average person on IC is there for 3 to 4 days. Corona patients are t ...[text shortened]... hem as the axioma for the debate.
I want to have hear thoughts on the dilemma at hand.
Thanks.
===For average, healthy people this isn’t a problem. But for the elderly and folk with underlying health problems it is. And most people know people who are old or quite sick.===
Average healthy people who are fully vaxxed are at very low risk from COVID. People who are very old or unhealthy are at higher risk, but they can also catch the virus from vaxxed people (albeit less likely). So, they would be wise to take steps to keep safe either way (such as by wearing a good mask in indoor public settings), Either way, forcing healthy people to vax doesn't really solve your problem.
As for consuming an outsized portion of healthcare resources, we don't look at that in almost any other context. Run the same splits using people who maintain a good diet and exercise and those who don't, and I'm sure the splits will be even more skewed.
There is no compelling reason on a societal level to force people to vaccinate. Yes, it will marginally increase the safety margin for others, but not dramatically. COVID is not smallpox. It's a disease that will kill maybe 1 in 5,000 fully vaccinated people upon exposure (maybe).
Let people make their own healthcare decisions and focus on convincing people rather than trying to shove the vaccine down their throats.
A "safe work environment" that an employer has the "responsibility" to provide does not mean a work environment where it is impossible to catch respiratory viruses. Such environments are rare and unrealistic in most cases.
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@mchill saidI don't agree with El's purely metallic way of looking at it, but let's look at this more closely:
I guess this makes us disposable, since we had the bad taste to age, rather than die. - Right? 🙄
You're over 60 (I'm deducing this from your post; if I'm wrong, say so). Presumably, you're fully vaxxed and either already boosted or should get your booster in the next few days.
After you're triple-vaxxed and let's say that you buy a stack of KN-95s from Amazon for about a dollar per mask and use them in every indoor crowd situation. Also assume that you stay out of real super-spreader possible events like Kraken games and indoor motorcycle rallies.
What do you think the odds of COVID killing you are? Here's a hint: not very high. Certainly, IMHO, not high enough to justify changing the fundamental nature of the way we live and the way we govern people's bodily autonomy.
@eladar saidStupid answer.
If they asked me to? Sure, if I do not want to do that I will drive.
Point being you cherry pick your issues to cry about your freedom with.
Your freedom mantra is little more than a catch phrase in your continuing push for the kind of America you want.
btw, I won't even bother getting into the Fauci narrative going around. Again !! 😴
@mghrn55 saidStupid as answer? I suppose from a leftist point of view.
Stupid answer.
Point being you cherry pick your issues to cry about your freedom with.
Your freedom mantra is little more than a catch phrase in your continuing push for the kind of America you want.
btw, I won't even bother getting into the Fauci narrative going around. Again !! 😴
@Eladar
I guess the question that should be put to the conservatives that are continually posting anti-pandemic response narratives in this forum is .........
What is an acceptable COVID 19 death toll in exchange for your political goals of taking back the House and Senate in 2022 and putting a Republican back in the White House in 2024 ??
There is no need to run around in circles with the multiple threads with multiple posts with numerous links I don't even bother to open.
Who has the guts to answer this question straight up ?
@mghrn55 saidYour opinion is your opinion. That is for sure.
@Eladar
I guess the question that should be put to the conservatives that are continually posting anti-pandemic response narratives in this forum is .........
What is an acceptable COVID 19 death toll in exchange for your political goals of taking back the House and Senate in 2022 and putting a Republican back in the White House in 2024 ??
There is no need t ...[text shortened]... umerous links I don't even bother to open.
Who has the guts to answer this question straight up ?
@sh76 saidDoesn't your whole argument suggest that the advice to get vaccinated, wear a mask and socially distance is the best way to mitigate risk of having an adverse Covid-19 episode?
I don't agree with El's purely metallic way of looking at it, but let's look at this more closely:
You're over 60 (I'm deducing this from your post; if I'm wrong, say so). Presumably, you're fully vaxxed and either already boosted or should get your booster in the next few days.
After you're triple-vaxxed and let's say that you buy a stack of KN-95s from Amazon for about a ...[text shortened]... y changing the fundamental nature of the way we live and the way we govern people's bodily autonomy.