- Joined
- 15 Sep 04
- Moves
- 7051
Has anyone here noticed that the standard to language is declining? Since the advent of the SMS boom, everyone seems to have abandoned conventional grammer and abolished spelling. Like the simple question, "are you coming to dinner" translates to "R U cuming 2 a smash*?" I was wondering if literacy standards were also diminishing in other countries too. In my country, Australia, kids seem to be forgetting how to write in the way I was taught at school. Is this indicative of just another trend in language or a more insidious goal to create a type of Newspeak like in 1984? I for one know that politicans like dumbing down language sometimes. First of all they reduce the texts children study and secondly they distort words out of their original meaning. I have very little idea what "middleman", "family values" and the like are intended to mean.
Now,I know that language is constantly changing. I wouldn't expect a teenager to write in blankverse like Shakespeare. But I would expect a teenager to be able to understand Shakespeare's blankverse. It seems to me that newer generations are evolving a simplified langauge that cannot communicate the same gamut of thoughts as our language. In fact, this jazzy new SMS language is almost antithetical to true thinking. I find that people who can express themselves in formal English are much easier to read and also more intelligent whereas those resort the "new millenium" lingo are idiots; capable of only the most facile thoughts. I find it distressing that all the cleverness that happens, even on this site, might become unintelligible in a century and like Shakspeare will be like writing in a like foreign language, yuh know?
Well, I for one will dot my i's and cross my t's and remember to use capital letters after a full stop.
*I assume the word "smash" means dinner but to be "smashed" is to be blind drunk. Maybe its the binge drinking thats causing it...
Originally posted by Conrau KI agree with you, I have trouble myself as I'm not good with english, I'm working on it though.
Has anyone here noticed that the standard to language is declining? Since the advent of the SMS boom, everyone seems to have abandoned conventional grammer and abolished spelling. Like the simple question, "are you coming to dinner" translates to "R U cuming 2 a smash*?" I was wondering if literacy standards were also diminishing in other countries too. In ...[text shortened]... mashed" is to be blind drunk. Maybe its the binge drinking thats causing it...
But it is way faster to text message on a cell phone using, R U redy 4 game of chess, VS, Are you ready for a game of chess?
- Joined
- 15 Sep 04
- Moves
- 7051
Originally posted by flyUnityWell its not just that. Even our literature has changed. Society, in general, appreciates only the most abherant literature: novels, poems, films -- they no longer challenge or extend us. We are in a world that praises the Da Vinci Code and looks at "Miss Congeniality" as a classic film. Watch any Oprah Winfrey show. Every book she endorses is about someone who overcomes adversity (not that theres anything wrong with that, but there's a limit). Every guest poses the same argument, "Well, look at me then, and now look at me now" in which the audience responds, "ah ha, ah ha, I'm with you" (I dont even know what that even means). Its just the same drivel over and over again. And the distressing thing is, is that the consumers buy into it every time. The best selling books are self-help and thriller -- and by thriller we're not talking Capote but some trash about a bad cop/good cop solving a murder case. There's nothing wrong with that but society is distancing its self from anything to intellectual. Its similar to "Nineteen Eighty-Four" and "Brave New wolrd" by Aldous Huxley, in that the works of Chaucer, Milton, Byron and Shakespeare can no longer exist since we can no longer understand or appreciate them. Firstly we are so desensitised and secondly we are so intellectually warped that literature is just the same, endlessly repeating narratives. And its the same with language too.
I agree with you, I have trouble myself as I'm not good with english, I'm working on it though.
But it is way faster to text message on a cell phone using, R U redy 4 game of chess, VS, Are you ready for a game of chess?
Originally posted by Conrau KThe English language as it currently exists is completely nonintuitive and needs a major overhaul. I see the same thing you see but I think it's a good sign.
Has anyone here noticed that the standard to language is declining? Since the advent of the SMS boom, everyone seems to have abandoned conventional grammer and abolished spelling. Like the simple question, "are you coming to dinner" translates to "R U cuming 2 a smash*?" I was wondering if literacy standards were also diminishing in other countries too. In ...[text shortened]... mashed" is to be blind drunk. Maybe its the binge drinking thats causing it...
Originally posted by Conrau KToo much TV-specifically MTV, too much video-gaming, i-podding, and parents who are themselves literary gnats are what is causing the demise of not just the English language but of civilization as a whole. I don't proclaim to be an outstanding writer, or grammatical wizard, but I know my A-hole from my elbow when it comes to composition......English 101, grade of B...27 years ago...
Has anyone here noticed that the standard to language is declining? Since the advent of the SMS boom, everyone seems to have abandoned conventional grammer and abolished spelling. Like the simple question, "are you coming to dinner" translates to "R U cuming 2 a smash*?" I was wondering if literacy standards were also diminishing in other countries too. In ...[text shortened]... mashed" is to be blind drunk. Maybe its the binge drinking thats causing it...
Language morphs, it is a proven fact. In spanish, the poor areas lose the "s" at the ends of their words. For example, most people understand the term "como estas." In poor or costal areas the same phrase sounds like "como esta," where the "s" part of the phrase is implied but not said. This is called lenition.
There are tons of examples in the English language as well. The language that survives won't be the "proper" English either.
- Joined
- 15 Sep 04
- Moves
- 7051
Originally posted by DraxusI acknowledge that language changes. That is not my point. Chaucer is a great example. His poetry is melange of English, French, some Welsh and with a Scottish accent. The point I am making is that the English language is changing for the worse. In this rudimentary English gaining increasing popularity, neither can the users articulate themselves with the same range of expression and nor can they fully understand themselves. Gradually we migh lose an abundant source of literature found in poets like Milton or in philosophers such as Hume.
Language morphs, it is a proven fact. In spanish, the poor areas lose the "s" at the ends of their words. For example, most people understand the term "como estas." In poor or costal areas the same phrase sounds like "como esta," where the "s" part of the phrase is implied but not said. This is called lenition.
There are tons of examples in the English language as well. The language that survives won't be the "proper" English either.
- Joined
- 15 Sep 04
- Moves
- 7051
Originally posted by AThousandYoungGiven that the English language is "nonintuitive" I still managed to understand what you just said. I challenge your assertion that English is non-intuitive. In fact, logic and intuition are first axquired from our native language. I find the English language quite intuitive. When I experiment with other languages it is them which is non-intuitive. For instance Italian, how many hundreds of tenses are really needed?
The English language as it currently exists is completely nonintuitive and needs a major overhaul. I see the same thing you see but I think it's a good sign.
I dont see these changes as a good sign. I see them as another part of Orwell's predictions.
Originally posted by Conrau Kgood speech Conrau !
Well its not just that. Even our literature has changed. Society, in general, appreciates only the most abherant literature: novels, poems, films -- they no longer challenge or extend us. We are in a world that praises the Da Vinci Code and looks at "Miss Congeniality" as a classic film. Watch any Oprah Winfrey show. Every book she endorses is about ...[text shortened]... just the same, endlessly repeating narratives. And its the same with language too.
- Joined
- 15 Sep 04
- Moves
- 7051
Originally posted by sasquatch672Ok, so the Da Vinci code is not an acclaimed novel, but it certainly is successful despite it being utter crap. As for Miss congeniality, that was voted in the top fifty classic films in my country. 😞
Really? What world do you live in? Jesus Christmas. Miss Conflegiarity, a classic.
- Joined
- 15 Sep 04
- Moves
- 7051
Originally posted by zeeblebotI believe that anyone who attempts to write like Shakespeare should be shot. There's just no place for pastiches in society. My point is that we are abandoning the origins of our literature. And how can we atempt to examine a contemporary text without an understanding of its precursors? One couldn't apply exegetical methods on the the gospel of Luke without knowledge of the Torah. Its the same with literature. The younger ones are avoiding Milton and the like by limiting their language.
i guess somewhere today there exists literature to compare with the old stuff. but not much of it.