22 Jun 10
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The Arizona senator[John Kyle] said that in a White House meeting with Barack Obama the president said he would not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on "comprehensive" immigration reform. Kyle, a Republican, quoted the president as saying that if he secures the border first, he'll never get Republicans on board for comprehensive reform.
The White House vehemently denied the assertion, adding that Kyle "knows" that Obama didn't say it. Kyle's office reaffirmed the accuracy of the quote.
http://www.chicagonow.com/blogs/dennis-byrne-barbershop/2010/06/whos-a-liar-sen-john-kyle-or-president-barack-obama.html
22 Jun 10
Originally posted by utherpendragonI think a storyline where you've got the U.S. president saying "I will not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on comprehensive immigration reform", to a state senator in a White House meeting, is a risible non-starter. 'Comic book' even. Maybe it works at state level - at least in some states. I don't know. But Kyle looks silly, for sure.
The Arizona senator[John Kyle] said that in a White House meeting with Barack Obama the president said he would not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on "comprehensive" immigration reform. Kyle, a Republican, quoted the president as saying that if he secures the border first, he'll never get Republicans on board for comprehensive reform.
Do you feel I am hijacking this thread?
22 Jun 10
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Originally posted by utherpendragonI like Kyl (no "e" ) and I have no idea who said what.
The Arizona senator[John Kyle] said that in a White House meeting with Barack Obama the president said he would not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on "comprehensive" immigration reform. Kyle, a Republican, quoted the president as saying that if he secures the border first, he'll never get Republicans on board for comprehensive refo ...[text shortened]... yle "knows" that Obama didn't say it. Kyle's office reaffirmed the accuracy of the quote.
However...
If the President did say "that if he secures the border first, he'll never get Republicans on board for comprehensive reform," he is probably correct. If there is ever to be immigration reform in something like the mold of McCain-Kennedy, the only way to get GOP support will be to trade tighter border controls for some level or [dare I say] tolerance/amnesty/legalization/whatever-you-want-to-call-it for the illegals already here.
It is odd that the White House would vehemently deny saying something that is probably true. Well, such is politics, I suppose.
22 Jun 10
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Originally posted by sh76Maybe it's utherpendragon who's misleading us with the wording. It's happened before. It is NOT odd that the White House would vehemently deny that president Barack Obama said he would not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on "comprehensive" immigration reform. So what is being claimed exactly? Is there anyone other than utherpendragon who can tell us exactly what these unsubstantiated claims that Kyl is making?
It is odd that the White House would vehemently deny saying something that is probably true. Well, such is politics, I suppose.
22 Jun 10
Originally posted by FMFI wonder if Kyl is lying,what could he possibly gain by doing so?
I think a storyline where you've got the U.S. president saying "I will not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on comprehensive immigration reform", to a state senator in a White House meeting, is a risible non-starter. 'Comic book' even. Maybe it works at state level - at least in some states. I don't know. But Kyle looks silly, for sure.
Do you feel I am hijacking this thread?
22 Jun 10
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Originally posted by utherpendragonWell what you claim he is claiming sounds like something lifted off a paranoid wingnut blog or a daft freeper conspiracy thread. So perhaps Kyl is cultivating his appeal to Obama hatebloggers or freepers.
I wonder if Kyl is lying,what could he possibly gain by doing so?
22 Jun 10
Originally posted by FMFNOW you are attempting to hi jack the thread.
Maybe it's utherpendragon who's misleading us with the wording. It's happened before. It is NOT odd that the White House would vehemently deny that president Barack Obama said he would not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on "comprehensive" immigration reform. So what is being claimed exactly? Is there anyone other than utherpendragon who can tell us exactly what these unsubstantiated claims that Kyl is making?
It usually takes you a couple of post to start personalizing and making it about you and me.
I understand. You are kinda like the mouse that roared.
The OP is not my words but from the article I quoted .
22 Jun 10
Originally posted by FMFIts actually all over the news in all fashions here in the UNITED STATES.
Well what you claim he is claiming sounds like something lifted off a paranoid wingnut blog or a daft freeper conspiracy thread. So perhaps Kyl is cultivating his appeal to Obama hatebloggers or freepers.
22 Jun 10
Originally posted by utherpendragonIt wouldn't be the first time we have been served up with aan OP with a "quote" that turns out to be some little nugget from a partisan disinformation campaign. Didn't you think the words - the exact words and turn of phrase - attributed to Obama (in indirect speech in your text) are ludicrous? Come on. I know you don't like him, but do you really think this president - or any president - would say "I will not secure U.S. borders until... [insert problem with political opponents here].."? Do you really?
The OP is not my words but from the article I quoted .
22 Jun 10
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Originally posted by FMFSubstantially the same story does appear all over the net.
Maybe it's utherpendragon who's misleading us with the wording. It's happened before. It is NOT odd that the White House would vehemently deny that president Barack Obama said he would not secure the border with Mexico until Congress moves on "comprehensive" immigration reform. So what is being claimed exactly? Is there anyone other than utherpendragon who can tell us exactly what these unsubstantiated claims that Kyl is making?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20008344-503544.html
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/06/21/kyl-obama-wont-secure-border-lawmakers-immigration-package/
http://dailycaller.com/2010/06/21/white-house-denies-claims-by-jon-kyl-that-obama-is-holding-border-security-hostage/
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2010/06/21/white-house-says-kyl-lies-on-immigration/
FWIW, I agree with Obama. Only a sense of urgency will cause the passage of immigration reform, which is such a hot button issue. Porous borders create the sense of urgency. If Kyl and Obama and Reid and co. want to solve the problem, then cancel the summer recess, lock the door and iron out a comprehensive compromise solution.
22 Jun 10
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Originally posted by utherpendragonSo is a lot of stuff that turns out to be untrue. Maybe Kyl is clever wielding a he-said-I-said thing in a political domain as poisonous and as polarized as the one in the U.S. Who knows? But do you seriously think that a president said "I will not secure the borders [of my nation] because/until blah blah blah..." to what is effectively a political opponent?
Its actually all over the news in all fashions here in the UNITED STATES.
22 Jun 10
Originally posted by sh76Thank you sh76.
Substantially the same story does appear all over the net.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20008344-503544.html
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/06/21/kyl-obama-wont-secure-border-lawmakers-immigration-package/
http://dailycaller.com/2010/06/21/white-house-denies-claims-by-jon-kyl-that-obama-is-holding-border-security-hostage/
http://blog ...[text shortened]... , then cancel the summer recess, lock the door and iron out a comprehensive compromise solution.
I don't know who is lying. Some one is though.
Thats why I wanted input on this.Not to be accused by a troll from God knows where of creating a misleading OP.