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Debates Forum

  1. 21 Nov '16 23:48
    I'm beginning to have my doubts. I'm thinking that what they'll do is throw in some tweaks and say that it's too late to repeal it entirely and then try to blame the Democrats for not working with them earlier. But considering that not one Republican offered an amendment which could earn their vote, it could be a tough sell except to the lowest of information voters. Meanwhile, there's concern that a sudden repeal without replacement could crash the economy. The Democrats at this point will probably just sit back and wait. Maybe at some point Trump, who isn't really a conservative though he plays one on TV, will lose patience and just propose a single payer universalizing of Medicare, if Ryan hasn't really made good on his effort to kill it.

    There are plenty of left Democrats who will ditch the insurance-lobby influenced centrists of the party to vote for something like that.

    Other than that, they may just say they gave it the college try and cry "rigged" in two years.

    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/i-got-to-see-replace-dems-bait-gop-to-unveil-and-ocare-replacement
  2. 22 Nov '16 00:47
    Not for this year. If they are people of their word then yes it will be repealed after this year.

    Since they are liars it won't be repealed.
  3. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    22 Nov '16 00:57
    Originally posted by Kunsoo
    I'm beginning to have my doubts. I'm thinking that what they'll do is throw in some tweaks and say that it's too late to repeal it entirely and then try to blame the Democrats for not working with them earlier. But considering that not one Republican offered an amendment which could earn their vote, it could be a tough sell except to the lowest of informati ...[text shortened]... tp://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/i-got-to-see-replace-dems-bait-gop-to-unveil-and-ocare-replacement
    They care more about their right wing base than they do about the 20 million who will get tossed off their health insurance. That base has cheered the 60 times the Republicans voted to repeal the ACA and will do so again.

    Only Trump insisting he will veto a straight up repeal would prevent it. I don't think he will do so.
  4. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    22 Nov '16 01:05
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    They care more about their right wing base than they do about the 20 million who will get tossed off their health insurance. That base has cheered the 60 times the Republicans voted to repeal the ACA and will do so again.

    Only Trump insisting he will veto a straight up repeal would prevent it. I don't think he will do so.
    There's a difference between passing token legislation that you know will be filibustered in the Senate and/or vetoed to charge up the base and passing it when it will actually become law. I'm not saying they for sure won't do it (I think they'll do it only if they have what they think is a good alternative), but I don't think the times it's passed the House is a great indication.
  5. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    22 Nov '16 01:46
    Originally posted by sh76
    There's a difference between passing token legislation that you know will be filibustered in the Senate and/or vetoed to charge up the base and passing it when it will actually become law. I'm not saying they for sure won't do it (I think they'll do it only if they have what they think is a good alternative), but I don't think the times it's passed the House is a great indication.
    A responsible political party would think like that; this Republican party doesn't. They've scheduled early votes in previous Congresses so new members could have the "honor" of voting for repeal. Odds are they will do so again as their base will insist on it.
  6. Subscriber Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    22 Nov '16 02:30 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    A responsible political party would think like that; this Republican party doesn't. They've scheduled early votes in previous Congresses so new members could have the "honor" of voting for repeal. Odds are they will do so again as their base will insist on it.
    My guess is they will "repeal" it right away by giving it a sunset date, giving them time to work out the replacement bill.
  7. 22 Nov '16 02:30
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    They care more about their right wing base than they do about the 20 million who will get tossed off their health insurance. That base has cheered the 60 times the Republicans voted to repeal the ACA and will do so again.

    Only Trump insisting he will veto a straight up repeal would prevent it. I don't think he will do so.
    Yeah, but in the past they could always count on an Obama veto to save their asses from disaster. But now, all of the sudden they actually have to govern.
  8. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    22 Nov '16 02:39
    Originally posted by Sleepyguy
    My guess is they will "repeal" it right away by giving it a sunset date, giving them time to work out the replacement bill.
    They've had six and a half years and haven't come up with anything that they were willing to put in front of the Republican caucus.
  9. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    22 Nov '16 02:42
    Originally posted by Kunsoo
    Yeah, but in the past they could always count on an Obama veto to save their asses from disaster. But now, all of the sudden they actually have to govern.
    They think the ACA is the disaster and that a return to old-fashioned free market principles are the solution.

    You think winning elections has changed their minds?
  10. Subscriber KingDavid403
    King David
    22 Nov '16 03:50
    Does anyone here have health insurance through the ACA. When it went into effect it did not affect me or my insurance. Just curious if it is really bad or good. Can not learn better than from those that have it.
  11. 22 Nov '16 04:21
    Originally posted by KingDavid403
    Does anyone here have health insurance through the ACA. When it went into effect it did not affect me or my insurance. Just curious if it is really bad or good. Can not learn better than from those that have it.
    I've heard mixed feelings. Mostly younger people hating to have to pay into it. But I know a couple in their sixties who had a huge drop in their insurance rates with ACA. Of course, they'll be on Medicare in a few years.

    That is, unless Ryan succeeds in gutting it.
  12. Subscriber KingDavid403
    King David
    22 Nov '16 04:28 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Kunsoo
    I've heard mixed feelings. Mostly younger people hating to have to pay into it. But I know a couple in their sixties who had a huge drop in their insurance rates with ACA. Of course, they'll be on Medicare in a few years.

    That is, unless Ryan succeeds in gutting it.
    Yeah, that is the same responses I've had. Then, I hear both pro and cons on the news from different sources. It is a good thing that 20 million more people have insurance. I was just wonder if it was as bad and expensive as some sources on the news claim it is. Thank you BTW.
  13. Subscriber Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    22 Nov '16 04:46
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    They've had six and a half years and haven't come up with anything that they were willing to put in front of the Republican caucus.
    Yeah so they'll give themselves a two year sunset on the ACA and hype the replacement bill for the midterms. Isn't that how it's done?
  14. 22 Nov '16 07:18
    Originally posted by Sleepyguy
    Yeah so they'll give themselves a two year sunset on the ACA and hype the replacement bill for the midterms. Isn't that how it's done?
    I think you may be right. It will also make sure that the ACA is the potential focus of the midterm campaign, rather than how they're going to gut Medicare or [insert idiotic thing Trump has done or said]. And it will send a message to Trump voters now that this administration is going to "get things done."
  15. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    22 Nov '16 13:48 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by Sleepyguy
    Yeah so they'll give themselves a two year sunset on the ACA and hype the replacement bill for the midterms. Isn't that how it's done?
    I've read about the alternatives that are being proposed. Most will help people who make a solid income; i.e., the upper middle class. They are based on things like destructibility of premiums, HSA expansion and allowing inter-state competition (which will absolutely drive down premiums). These things will definitely help people like me; i.e., people who can afford health insurance but whose premiums have skyrocketed - and I do mean SKYROCKETED - recently.

    Basically, if we divide the middle class (I'm not worried about the rich, who can afford whatever the premiums are, or the poor, who are Medicaid-eligible) into 4 quartiles, I think these solutions are:

    - excellent for the upper quartile
    - of questionable but some value for the third quartile
    - of dubious value for the second quartile
    - of little or no value for the lowest quartile

    For the lower two quartiles of the middle class, the Medicaid expansion and premium subsidies of the ACA do a better job. If they keep the Medicaid expansion and premium subsidies and deregulate, allow interstate competition and expand HSA access or make premiums deductible, that is what I would support.