If there is one thing that belongs to the entire human race at this point in our history, it is the International Space Station and the space programs of all nations in general.
It breaks my heart that right now the destruction of the Columbia is being whitewashed in one of the biggest lies and coverups ever perpetrated upon the human race.
NASA continued the lie yesterday when they reported that once the re-entry began, there was nothing.... even the jettisoning of 16 tons of equipment that could have prevented the destruction of the shuttle.
The lie is very subtle. The key is that they are not investigating the real failure. Which was, that THEY NEVER HAD A GUY SUIT UP , TIE A ROPE AROUND HIS WAIST AND FLOAT OUT AND INSPECT THE WING even though several engineers thought they should and that there was severe damage to it. Think about that. They have already said that he mission was not prepared for an EVA event. That is a lie. From the aft shaft behind the crew compartment, emergency evacuation can always be done. IT REQUIRES THAT ALL CREW BE IN SUITS BEFORE OPENING THE HATCH. This was deemed oo dangerous. Better to re-enter the atmosphere at 17,000 MPH with no left wing! <expletive deleted> Maybe they didn't have a 30 foot piece of rope, ya think?
They are deliberately trying to cover their butts because it would be a little dangerous to egress unless absolutely necessary. Duh! Like six thousand degrees F. isn't dangerous?
What if they had just simply gone out and looked and saw the damage on the third or fourth day of the mission? Is there anything they could have done? Yes. And this is critical and the second part they are trying to cover up. There was a full 10 days until the next Russian Soyuz was scheduled to be at the International Space Station to resupply it. Reroute the Soyuz to the Shuttle with supplies... oxygen, energy and water and food. Then crash out emergency missions to rescue the crew and resupply the space station. And don't tell me the human race couldn't do that, or I will scream! We could have bought a month or two in which to rescue them, BUT WE NEVER EVEN TRIED. WE NEVER EVEN LOOKED. What a pittiful state nasa has fallen into. When they reached the moon there were 17 total employees devoted to PR and mass communications as they called it. Now there are Over 7000 people at nasa (and contractors) whose only job is to spin the truth. When we went to the moon, there were 20 engineers, techy's and workmen for every bureacrat. Now there are 4 bureaucrats for every WORTHWHILE PERSON. I am more outraged over this than you will ever know.
Originally posted by StarValleyWyTears run down my face.
If there is one thing that belongs to the entire human race at this point in our history, it is the International Space Station and the space programs of all nations in general.
It breaks my heart that right now the destruction of the Columbia is being whitewashed in one of the biggest lies and coverups ever perpetrated upon the human race.
NASA c ...[text shortened]... 4 bureaucrats for every WORTHWHILE PERSON. I am more outraged over this than you will ever know.
It should never have happened.
Linda.
Originally posted by StarValleyWyWhile I agree that not everything is being told, here are some logical responses to what happened:
If there is one thing that belongs to the entire human race at this point in our history, it is the International Space Station and the space programs of all nations in general.
It breaks my heart that right now the destruction of the Columbia is being whitewashed in one of the biggest lies and coverups ever perpetrated upon the human race.
NASA c ...[text shortened]... 4 bureaucrats for every WORTHWHILE PERSON. I am more outraged over this than you will ever know.
THEY NEVER HAD A GUY SUIT UP , TIE A ROPE AROUND HIS WAIST AND FLOAT OUT AND INSPECT THE WING
- SpaceHab was in the payload bay. Therefore, there wasn't an airlock to use for EVA's.
There was a full 10 days until the next Russian Soyuz was scheduled to be at the International Space Station to resupply it. Reroute the Soyuz to the Shuttle with supplies... oxygen, energy and water and food.
- It is a Progress cargo ship, not a Soyuz. Yes, this could have been done.
Yes, it was a tragedy, and maybe something could have been done. But, if you remember correctly, they didn't think John Glenn was going to make it back.
Do I think there is a cover-up? No, but I think alot of people are trying to cover their backsides.
Originally posted by willatkinsYou are right... and wrong...
While I agree that not everything is being told, here are some logical responses to what happened:
THEY NEVER HAD A GUY SUIT UP , TIE A ROPE AROUND HIS WAIST AND FLOAT OUT AND INSPECT THE WING
- SpaceHab was in the payload bay. Therefore, there wasn't an airlock to use for EVA's.
There was a full 10 days until the next Russian Soyuz was sched ...[text shortened]... there is a cover-up? No, but I think alot of people are trying to cover their backsides.
- SpaceHab was in the payload bay. Therefore, there wasn't an airlock to use for EVA's.
This is what they are saying (actually spinning in a big way)... the truth is that while the "air lock" in the middle deck is inoperable, the good old side hatch from the crew compartment is ALWAYS USEABLE. It has three basic modes of operation. Normal as when it swing/slides for normal crew and support crew egress and entry. On Pad emergency allows manual explosive seperation and In flight emergency allows manual explosive sep + manual deployment of the emergency exit pole. The only requirement for use on orbit is the decompression of the crew compartment (which can be accomplised three different ways.) They train for this all the time. Hence my original statement stands. They (managers and bureaucrats all) considered it too dangerous to have the crew suit up, open the side hatch and step ouside to have a look.
Do I think there is a cover-up? Only in the sense that the PR guys are doing as you say and covering very large quantities of Glutimus Maximus all over nasa. For example, all references to the method of on orbit use of the side hatch have been removed from the official nasa web sites. I know they were there a few years back, because i read them. Now they are gone. Is that a cover-up? or just good "information management"?
We just have to be watchful. I want to see an investigation into the options ON ORBIT. They are spinning the "camera's from the ground and aircraft" thing. BS. Just step outside and have a look. As a pilot, I and every other pilot knows that we are responsible for the walk around and safty inspection of our craft before putting it and our passengers into any flight mode. The best trained pilots in the world don't know this? I think they were over-ruled (or just kept in the dark) about the possible damage and precluded from a simple inspection because of the (minimal) danger of decompressing the crew compartment.
Next time you see a shuttle disembarking crew on the end of the runway at kennedy, notice that the side crew hatch IS OPENED AND OPERATED FROM INSIDE... nothing is required from those waiting outside on the downscamp.
Originally posted by willatkinsThanks for the link. It is excellent, and to quote just a small part of it shows exactly my point... following is from the Oberg article at willatkins provided link...
This article explains in much better detail what I was trying to say...
http://www.msnbc.com/news/874274.asp
Quote...
But the flight controllers I’ve talked with after the disaster had no doubts they could have thrown together a workable plan in a day or two, if asked. They would have first completely checked it out in ground simulation facilities, such as the giant water tank where floating spacesuited astronauts mimic zero gravity, and then told the crew what to do.
The trick would be to break some safety rules, but not too many. One astronaut would unhook his or her safety line from the shuttle, and the shuttle would fire its thrusters to gently move about 200 feet away. It then would roll 180 degrees, turning its belly to the free-floating astronaut. Sure, he or she would probably be slowly turning end over end in space. But he or she would be able to eyeball the area of suspected damage and take digital still images and zoomed video. Then the shuttle would slowly roll another 180 degrees and move back to retrieve the astronaut, like a giant catcher’s mitt enveloping a pop foul.
Unquote...
What the second paragraph doesn't mention is the obvious easy solution. As per my original... "Tie a rope around one of them and float out to have a look". <note: the floater might have needed to take some trash bags to "throw" for manuevering. see Newtons laws.>
I just hope that the spin meisters don't get away with this "there is nothing we could have done" crap. It was just a classic failure to take a minor risk that is getting my dander up. Now all they have to do is say "we screwed up" and all is forgiven. This is a dangerous thing that we are attempting. The mistake can be forgiven. But not these deliberate and wide spread efforts to cover it up and misdirect our attention. That is my only point, and I think you and I will probably agree on that completely. And in the future always... and i mean always... give the commander on scene the authority to do a classic "walk around" of his/her craft whenever there is any question at all about possible damage.
Originally posted by StarValleyWyi am i no way tring to say that you are wrong, in fact i think that you are right, but do you work for nasa or any type of space companie, org., or any thing else?
If there is one thing that belongs to the entire human race at this point in our history, it is the International Space Station and the space programs of all nations in general.
It breaks my heart that right now the destruction of the Columbia is being whitewashed in one of the biggest lies and coverups ever perpetrated upon the human race.
NASA c ...[text shortened]... 4 bureaucrats for every WORTHWHILE PERSON. I am more outraged over this than you will ever know.
Originally posted by Weird AlNo. Just that I have always been a space enthusiast. L5 society, Planetary Society, Mars Society, The Viking Fund... to name a few. And a sucker for donations to anything that will further the cause of getting us out of our cradle and into space where we belong. I do know how to fly airplanes and i do mess around in a P51 and an L39 trainer on occasion. (Am on the unofficial ground crew at the Reno air races each year for a friends unlimited class P51 and/or Seafury. Depends on which he is racing that year). That's about as close to space as i'll ever get.
i am i no way tring to say that you are wrong, in fact i think that you are right, but do you work for nasa or any type of space companie, org., or any thing else?
This post is made in the hope that it might further the idea that "reactionary" civilization is not good. I look at the big, long picture. If more people would not "lose interest" and/or "become bored" or view a vital issue as "old news"... think what a society we could raise. Fully conscious and functional instead of reacting like mice on fire.
5-24-2003 NASA today announced that "it would have been technically feasible to have rescued the crew of Columbia, if the extent of the damage to the left wing had been known.".... ANGER... STEP OUT THE DAMN DOOR ON ORBIT AND LOOK! DUH? yea, we know that... why do we let these guys "spin" this crap for a couple of months and then get away with public reations bowel movements all over us? Because modern man lacks the capacity of concentration. If we could just learn to think in terms of months, or better...years, instead of seconds... my, what a beautiful world we could create. Become Conscious! Join the Revolution! Vive la Pense!