20 Sep 04
The Scherzo in C minor from the F.A.E. Sonata, written as a birthday 'gift' to Clara Schumann, performed by Leonid Kogan on violin and accompanied on piano by his daughter Nina is one of my all-time faves. This piece rocks! Powerful, soaring, lovely.
Can anyone tell me what F.A.E. stands for?
Thank you. 🙂
20 Sep 04
2 edits
Originally posted by eagles54"frei aber einsam"
The Scherzo in C minor from the F.A.E. Sonata, written as a birthday 'gift' to Clara Schumann...
Can anyone tell me what F.A.E. stands for?
Free, but alone.
This was the motto of the little clique of musicians which included the three composers of this piece, the person to whom it was dedicated (Joseph Joachim) and others. The Scherzo (which is the only movement anyone ever hears) is by Brahms.
It wasn't for Clara Schumann, to my knowledge (but Brahms did have a thing for her, so it might have been ostensibly for Joachim, but clandestinely for Clara).
Nemesio
20 Sep 04
1 edit
Originally posted by eagles54Not sure, but I think the following: 'Frei Aber Einsam', that is how Schuman, Brahms and Dietrich described their little group that composed together this piece.
The Scherzo in C minor from the F.A.E. Sonata, written as a birthday 'gift' to Clara Schumann, performed by Leonid Kogan on violin and accompanied on piano by his daughter Nina is one of my all-time faves. This piece rocks! Powerful, soa ...[text shortened]... ly.
Can anyone tell me what F.A.E. stands for?
Thank you. 🙂
edit. didn't see the previous reply. I thought Joachim was the performing violinist, but I could be wrong again.
20 Sep 04
Originally posted by nemesioI did a little research on this.
This was the motto of the little clique of musicians which included the three composers of this piece, the person to whom it was dedicated (Joseph Joachim) and others. The Scherzo (which is the only movement anyone ever hears) is by Brahms.
Evidently, Frei aber einsam was Joachim's personal motto, though it was adopted in a way by the clique of musicians which included Brahms, Schumann, and Dietrich (and others, I think).
Brahms, himself, adopted a similar motto, "Frei aber froh'" which means, 'Free but happy,' something which, as the young Brahms aged, did not turn out to be true.
Apparently, the sonata makes use of F A-flat E as a motive; Brahms used F A(-flat) F as a motive in at least two of his symphonies.
Nemesio
20 Sep 04
Originally posted by eagles54As I said, I've never heard this. I've always heard that the composite sonata was dedicated to Joseph Joachim (and the little research I did confirms this).
The DVD is narrated by Eric Friedman, who explains about the scherzo being written for Clara Schumann. Whether correct or not, I do not know.
However, Brahms dedicated all sorts of things to Clara in secret, so it's not outside of the realm of possibility. I've just never heard it.
Nemesio
20 Sep 04
Originally posted by eagles54These sentiments (of freedom and aloneness) are pretty concordant with 19th c. German artistic/aesthetic pathos. I mean, just read Göthe or Müller poems (many of which were set by Schumann, or earlier by Schubert). Every third poem has 'einsam' as a topos, it seems, and freedom is often not far behind.
Free, but alone? I do not understand this.
Consider the entire Winterreisse cycle (Schubert). I mean, talk about "free but alone!" Die Schöne Müllerin by Schubert moves towards similar sentiment as the girl runs off with the hunter. Similarly, Schumann uses this sentiment in his Dichterliebe, especially in 'Ich Grolle Nicht.' Or, even more dramatically in Berlioz's Symphony Fantasique. A certain fatalistic perspective pervaded 19th c. German thought.
Probably the most obvious piece that captures the 'Free but alone' dual sentiment is Schubert's last piece, Das Hirt auf dem Felsen (I think completed on his deathbed in late October of 1828). In this tripartite piece, the opening and final sections are all about freedom and happiness (at least ostensibly), in a cheerful B-flat major (a Pastoral key, to be sure). The middle section is in, as I recall, a painful g-minor (or is it g-flat minor, or both?) and is about how lonely the shepherd is. I seem to recall that the text is a composite, but I can't find my score, so I can't confirm details. Anyone not familiar with this piece should endeavor to listen to it at least a few times, not because of its musical merit (it's not Schubert's most brilliant music), but because the juxtaposition of happy and sad, light and dark, major and minor, so utterly captures Schubert's dying state-of-mind: free, but alone.
Look at the graphic art that was coming out of that period: Slightly blurry, pastoral landscapes with a few characters if any, usually with a certain resignation about life. None of those crisp, clean lines of the 18th c., with their fantasic characters (dragons, unicorns and so forth), heroes and maidens to be rescued.
Beethoven was among the first musicians to capture this sentiment and ones related to it (the so-called 'Sturm und drang'😉. As Beethoven was pivotal in 19th c. German musical development (and subsequently elsewhere), it was not surprising that other composers adopted such an attitude in their lives and music. I'm not saying Beethoven invented it -- he was a product of his time, for sure -- but his music was the first to really express those tensions (c.f., his early Pathetique Sonata).
Nemesio
20 Sep 04
Thank you very much, Nemesio for your insight. At least I now have an inkling of how some of the thinkers of that time viewed 'free, but alone.'
Does freedom in that context mean to be alone, and to be lonely? If that's the case, I would not say that could be freedom at all, but ego-clinging. In true freedom, one is alone in that experience yet never 'lone'-ly.
20 Sep 04
1 edit
Originally posted by eagles54i agree.
If that's the case, I would not say that could be freedom at all, but ego-clinging. In true freedom, one is alone in that experience yet never 'lone'-ly.
consider these words from the song bobbie mcgee "freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose".
consider, what is definitely worth losing.
consider what always still stays behind.
or that delightful scene from the original kung-fu series with the young kwai chung cain who is bemoaning the loss of his parents and tells his blind teacher he feels so lonely. his teacher says something like, "do you not hear the birds singing and the leaves rustling? are you not aware of the insects and all the animals that abound? in such a crowded place, you are lonely! you tell me, which one of us is the more blind."
in friendship,
prad
20 Sep 04
For a long, long time after I'd heard Janis' lyrics, I wondered what she'd meant by that particularly striking turn of phrase. Coming from a person that had what seemed like a very lonely yet 'crowded' life, it must have come to her in a moment of real clarity. Unfortunately, in an effort to keep self from knowing real loneliness, we cause much misery for ourselves and others. We can't bear aloneness. It implies separation.
Loneliness can only occur when we separate our 'selves' from our experience. When fully involved in the awareness of our experience, free from distinctions such as 'self' and 'other,' the notion of being alone cannot arise as its basis is ego.
Free, but indivisible! 😉
20 Sep 04
Originally posted by eagles54Actually Janis did not write this song. You would have to ask Kris Kristoferson what he meant by those lyrics as he was the writer of "Me and Bobby McGee"
For a long, long time after I'd heard Janis' lyrics, I wondered what she'd meant by that particularly striking turn of phrase. Coming from a person that had what seemed like a very lonely yet 'crowded' life, it must have come to her in a moment of real clarity. Unfortunately, in an effort to keep self from knowing real loneliness, we cause much misery ...[text shortened]... her,' the notion of being alone cannot arise as its basis is ego.
Free, but indivisible! 😉
Regards,
Charlie
22 Sep 04
Originally posted by nemesioIn case someone was looking for this, it's Der Hirt auf dem Felsen not 'Das Hirt...'
Probably the most obvious piece that captures the 'Free but alone' dual sentiment is Schubert's last piece, Das Hirt auf dem Felsen (I think completed on his deathbed in late October of 1828).
Nemesio