General
31 Jan 21
I was reading through this informative review of the 1918 pandemic, which infected a third of the then world population and killed an estimated 20-50 million people.
The second wave was brutal and I feel casts an interesting contrast with this subsequent wave of COVID-19 which we are combating.
https://www.history.com/topics/world-war-i/1918-flu-pandemic
@earl-of-trumps saidThat might be because it occurred after WW1.
Here's something to tack on to the perspective:
The Spanish Flu did nothing to stop 30 countries from fighting each other in WWI
01 Feb 21
@earl-of-trumps saidThe steady accumulation of somewhere in the region of 40,000,000 military and civilian casualties during World War I did nothing to stop 30 countries from fighting each other until it did stop. That's something to tack on to your perspective.
Here's something to tack on to the perspective:
The Spanish Flu did nothing to stop 30 countries from fighting each other in WWI
@divegeester saidSo we can be thankful for several points:
I was reading through this informative review of the 1918 pandemic, which infected a third of the then world population and killed an estimated 20-50 million people.
The second wave was brutal and I feel casts an interesting contrast with this subsequent wave of COVID-19 which we are combating.
https://www.history.com/topics/world-war-i/1918-flu-pandemic
* advances in medicine that allowed to identify the culprit early and to begin to find countermeasures
* advances in pharmacology which allowed to develop and certify several vaccines within month.
* the absence of a big war so that we have in most countries no shortage of medicinal personal (as compared to normalcy)
* No medicinal koryphae who is suggesting to take medicine in harmful doses.
All in all we have a much better situation than our ancestors 100 years earlier.
@trev33 saidThis is not Debates, just two questions:
Or perhaps covid isn't as deadly as they want you to believe.
Do we observe excess mortality?
Do we observe full ICU's?
I would ask to reserve judgement for the time after the situation has ended and the data have been analysed with the additional advantage of hindsight.
@ponderable saidIndeed, my thoughts exactly.
So we can be thankful for several points:
* advances in medicine that allowed to identify the culprit early and to begin to find countermeasures
* advances in pharmacology which allowed to develop and certify several vaccines within month.
* the absence of a big war so that we have in most countries no shortage of medicinal personal (as compared to normalcy)
* No med ...[text shortened]... n harmful doses.
All in all we have a much better situation than our ancestors 100 years earlier.
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@divegeester saidI know people who think it's all made up, a massive conspiracy by the governments to control the population, I'm not one of these people but something isn't right about this.
Do you suspect a conspiracy of some sort?
Will reply to Pondy here as well, mortality is an interesting one and it's actually very hard to find stats on the number of people dying in each country to compare them with previous years. There are more people living on this planet than ever before so to compare pure numbers with 30 years ago is unfair and doesn't show the full picture, the only thing to look at is percentage of deaths per population and this isn't up by a great deal in the UK on recent years. Up, yes, I don't doubt that there is a virus and it can kill people but so can the flu, cancer... The list goes on.
The actual 'death with covid' stats are a complete scam, this 28 days within a positive test, ridiculous. My sister in law works at a hospital, she actually thinks it's quieter than previous years because some departments have closed, the real pandemic will be in the following years, people not getting treatment they needed, mental health and breathing problems from wearing the face masks too much. Not so much in Europe, I believe it's only Spain it's necessary to wear them outside but the entire continent of S. America they're mandatory to wear at all times. Can you imagine walking around in 33c all day wearing a mask? Crazy. And little kids, even the WHO says kids under 5 shouldn't be wearing them but here they do.
So, this is more my feeling, id rather protect the future than the past. People get old and die, it's the way of life and a necessary thing, why close schools, offices, bars, restaurants, push unemployment figures up to try and prevent the inevitable?
@trev33You make it sound like old people are ready, willing and eager to die? Well they’re not as you will discover one day. No one has any right to hurry them along to an early grave and they also have relatives who may want them around for as long as possible.
So, this is more my feeling, id rather protect the future than the past. People get old and die, it's the way of life and a necessary thing, why close schools, offices, bars, restaurants, push unemployment figures up to try and prevent the inevitable?
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@drewnogal saidI didn't say that, please don't add words to my post that weren't there. Of course it's sad when anyone dies from any illness or disease but it's the natural way of life, being locked up in your home, some usable to go to school, others unable to work is not.
You make it sound like old people are ready, willing and eager to die? Well they’re not as you will discover one day. No one has any right to hurry them along to an early grave and they also have relatives who may want them around for as long as possible.
Explain to be how people in their 80s plus test positive but are completely fine and the average age of death is the same as always?
It's not that I don't care about people dying, but I care more about people living and building a future and don't believe that this virus is anywhere near as bad as mainstream media would have you believe. Other, non government baxked scientists and doctors say other things regarding the virus but they are censored, why?
02 Feb 21
@earl-of-trumps saidIt is believed that conditions of the war such as overcrowding and global troop movements helped the 1918 flu spread.
Here's something to tack on to the perspective:
The Spanish Flu did nothing to stop 30 countries from fighting each other in WWI
02 Feb 21
@trev33 said“Scam”
I know people who think it's all made up, a massive conspiracy by the governments to control the population, I'm not one of these people but something isn't right about this.
The actual 'death with covid' stats are a complete scam, this 28 days within a positive test, ridiculous.
What’s the scam? Why?
Why are the ICUs full of covid patients?
@trev33 saidThe biggest problem here in the UK is that the NHS has been close to breaking point, once in the spring and then around Christmas. Before the pandemic it took about 4 hours to be fully assessed at our local A&E depts. Now we hear of ambulances queuing outside, waiting to get sick people admitted and then finding that there are no available beds with up to a third having been used by Covid cases. This leaves us wondering when the hospitals will ever get back on track with looking after the people needing transplants or cancer treatment? Left unchecked, for the sake of the economy? It would only worsen.
I didn't say that, please don't add words to my post that weren't there. Of course it's sad when anyone dies from any illness or disease but it's the natural way of life, being locked up in your home, some usable to go to school, others unable to work is not.
Explain to be how people in their 80s plus test positive but are completely fine and the average age of death is th ...[text shortened]... nment baxked scientists and doctors say other things regarding the virus but they are censored, why?
The Co-op funeral service revealed a 22% rise in its funerals for the first six months of 2020, compared with the same period last year so people are dying at a faster rate.