Originally posted by Rank outsider200 will not be enough my friend, hmmm, batsmen, I need to think on that, seeing
By the time the reverse swing kicks in, they will have 200 on the board. Enough to build a total that will be out of reach of your lot.
Your batting line up?
that you have the best two spinners evah in your team, I will need to include,
Aravinda de Silva
Jayasuriya
Saeed Anwar
Javed Miandad
Andy Flower
Rahul Dravid
impressive or what?
Originally posted by robbie carrobieA 200 start, I said, leading to about a 400 total. Assuming there is some swing. If not, we can declare when we want to, and my biggest managerial challenge will be explaining to Ian Botham why he never gets to bat.
200 will not be enough my friend, hmmm, batsmen, I need to think on that, seeing
that you have the best two spinners evah in your team, I will need to include,
Aravinda de Silva
Jayasuriya
Saeed Anwar
Javed Miandad
Andy Flower
Rahul Dravid
impressive or what?
I think you have 4 greats in your team. Useful match practice, I would call it, but nothing to get unduly concerned over.
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Originally posted by Rank outsiderLol, I see, useful match practice, how will Lara and Sachin deal with my bowling attack,
A 200 start, I said, leading to about a 400 total. Assuming there is some swing. If not, we can declare when we want to, and my biggest managerial challenge will be explaining to Ian Botham why he never gets to bat.
I think you have 4 greats in your team. Useful match practice, I would call it, but nothing to get unduly concerned over.
they are great players of spin for sure, but i have no spinners. Sigh I remember when
Tendulkar was dropped, the whole of Pakistan took in a deep breath and wept!
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI think you will find Lara and Tendulkar made some of their runs against non-spinners.
Lol, I see, useful match practice, how will Lara and Sachin deal with my bowling attack,
they are great players of spin for sure, but i have no spinners. Sigh I remember when
Tendulkar was dropped, the whole of Pakistan took in a deep breath and wept!
And their averages against Pakistan were in excess of 50 and 40 respectively. 90 might be enough to take out most of your top order with my opening attack.
As my rules stipulated, this is a spinning wicket, so if it gets to the third day, you are up the proverbial.
I hear Ashley Giles still plays if you are interested......?
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I notice that your posts have all been given a thumbs down. Not by me, I assure you, so unless you are thumbing yourself (which is not healthy, believe me) we have a bit of a mystery.
There is a principle of UK law that defendents should know who their accusers are.
Come out of the shadows, please!
Originally posted by FMFIan Botham was a bit 'heart over head' but I would add that, when I put together a list like this, it is always taken as players at their peak.
No Ian Botham for me. Adam Gilchrist at 7. Imran Khan at 8.
'Compared with many of cricket's greatest players, most of whom were specialists, Botham's averages seem fairly ordinary but this overlooks Botham's all-rounder status, which is rarely achieved at world-class level.
Of note, Botham's first 202 wickets came at 21.20 per wicket, while his final 181 cost on average 36.43 apiece; the first average is one that would make Botham one of the greatest bowlers of the modern era, ranking alongside the West Indian greats Curtly Ambrose (career average 20.99), Malcolm Marshall (career average 20.94), and Joel Garner (career average 20.97), but the second average depicts a player who, as a specialist bowler, would be unable to sustain a place in many Test teams. This difference can be largely attributed to a back injury which limited Botham's bowling pace and his ability to swing the ball.
Botham's batting – although never the equal of his bowling abilities – declined as well, with a batting average of 38.80 for his first 51 Tests substantially higher than the 28.87 he managed in his last 51 Tests, again a number that would be considered unsatisfactory for a specialist batsman in most Test sides.
In the first 5 years of Botham's Test career, when not playing as captain, he scored 2557 runs at an average of 49.17 including 11 centuries and a highest score of 208, took 196 wickets at an average of 21.28 including nineteen 5 wicket hauls and held 50 catches.
Such figures denote a player who would easily maintain a place in any Test side as a specialist batsman or bowler alone. During this period his reputation as one of the leading Test all-rounders was firmly established.'
From wikipedia
Having said that, can't really argue for too long about Imran Khan.
Originally posted by Rank outsiderFrom cricinfo: "And whereas Botham declined steadily, Imran just got better and better: in his last 10 years of international cricket [while captaining a fractious team from the front] he played 51 Tests, averaging a sensational 50 with the bat and 19 with the ball."
Having said that, can't really argue for too long about Imran Khan.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/40560.html
Originally posted by Rank outsiderMathew Hayden?
As promised, best test team from anyone who played test cricket after 1980:
1 Sunil Gavaskar
2Matthew Hayden
3Sachin Tendulkar
4Vivien Richards
5Brian Lara
6Jacques Kallis
7Ian Botham
8Adam Gilchrist
9Shane Warne
10Dennis Lillee
11Malcolm Marshall
12Muttiah Muralitharan
(substitute for Ian Botham depending on amount of spin likely to be on offer)
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Originally posted by Rank outsiderNo.5 and 6 could have been a number of other players, especially if you are picking players on later form rather than earlier form (or vice versa) in their careers like Steve Waugh who ended up averaging around 50, which is quite remarkable considering he was initially a bowling all rounder who batted at 7 or 8 and averaged less than 30 with the bat.
As promised, best test team from anyone who played test cricket after 1980:
1 Sunil Gavaskar
2Matthew Hayden
3Sachin Tendulkar
4Vivien Richards
5Brian Lara
6Jacques Kallis
7Ian Botham
8Adam Gilchrist
9Shane Warne
10Dennis Lillee
11Malcolm Marshall
12Muttiah Muralitharan
(substitute for Ian Botham depending on amount of spin likely to be on offer)
Originally posted by FMFWhich further backs up my point that you have to determine if you are picking a player on his whole career or just the best bits of his career.
From cricinfo: "And whereas Botham declined steadily, Imran just got better and better: in his last 10 years of international cricket [while captaining a fractious team from the front] he played 51 Tests, averaging a sensational 50 with the bat and 19 with the ball."
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/40560.html
Originally posted by karoly aczelI considered Greenidge, but I think Hayden is one of those players who, for some reason, is consistently underated.
Mathew Hayden?
Ditto Kallis. I have seen many professional commentators choosing 'best' teams of this ilk not even consider him for a position in the side. One didn't even have him in the list of 'top 3' potential all-rounders!
And yet his test batting average is better than Tendulkar's and he could arguably command a place on his batting alone. Yet Tendulkar is one everyone's list. OK, stats aren't everything, but even so......
Originally posted by karoly aczelToo many painful memories of Waugh putting us to the sword when we thought we might be able to get the Ashes back......
No.5 and 6 could have been a number of other players, especially if you are picking players on later form rather than earlier form (or vice versa) in their careers like Steve Waugh who ended up averaging around 50, which is quite remarkable considering he was initially a bowling all rounder who batted at 7 or 8 and averaged less than 30 with the bat.