This is not meant as a sexist dig at either side, and I know there are
several people who hold strong views on this subject, but after some
prompting I've been persuaded to bring this question to the forum...
"all male instincts have been made taboo by society, while female
characteristics are encoraged." - discuss
eg. the male mammal is typically polygimouse (sp?), aggressive,
independant, prone to show off in stupidly dangerous ways; all
frowned upon to a greater or lesser extent. Whereas the female
mammal is nurturing, passive (most of the time), seeks groups; which
is encoraged..
Have we made being male unacceptable? Is dulling of male instincts
necessary to form any cohesive society? Have we in the last 100 years
turned into a matriacle society??
It has become perfectly acceptable to denegrate men in "amusing"
ways in the media. A few examples: Progresso Soup- (coming from
the woman every time) "Hey, isn't it time to grow up?!" Imagine the
response if it had come from the man. Barenstain Bears children's
books. I used to read these to my kids. Clearly the most sexist
literature ever written. The father is constantly portrayed as a buffoon
and always needing to be corrected by the all-knowing bear of a wife.
I got wise and threw them all out. I could go on and on and as you
can tell I have some feelings about this. Does modern man have
problems? You bet. We can be aggressive, detached, work
obsessed, and sexist/racist. Does denegrating men help with any of
these issues? No. A question to the men on the site. What is it you
most in a woman? (to gay men- what do you want most in a partner?)
Kirk
I haven't spoken to my wife for 18 months: I don't like to interrupt
her.
---------------------------------------
Our last fight was my fault: My wife asked me "What's on the TV?"
I said, "Dust!"
----------------------------------------
In the beginning, God created the earth and rested. Then God
created Man and rested. Then God created Woman. Since then,
neither God nor Man has rested.
Ladies don't hate me.
Gene
The Elder
well for a good example of this just look at the way the James bonds
films have progressed. And you`ll see how things have changed for us
men. Suddenly there are very strong and powerful and dominant
female characters (NOT A BAD THING!!! NO FLAME!) rather than just
the quiet timid bonds play girls.
just a thought use it don`t use it.
Gregg
I think what you are saying is true BF, but on the otherhand it is only
a rebalance of what has been an overly masculine society throughout
the ages. Where women have been downtrodded because of their sex.
Women would still say that they are still paid less than men even
though they have the same qualifications when applying for the same
job. That they have had to take the
Gillian Rose wrote about feminism in society and the nature to which
feminine issues are applying themselves to society. And it is a pretty
good read especially when it raises issues that you (as men) dont
really think of..) For eg The feminist approach to space.... men can
wander along happily down streets without any threat - happily
smoking a ciggy or whatever but women have to consider the threat of
attack etc ... different perceptions of space ... and this is incumbent
throughout all aspects of life.
Furthermore to advance in jobs and life certain women have to make
more sacrifices to gain the same advantages as men and therefore
become more dedicated ... this again may create the impression that
women are 'taking over the world'. This is probably excacerbated by
the fact that women are always on telly in some skimpy thing trying to
sell something else ... whether it be hair products or things only
targetted at men - the power of female sexuality !
I dont think it is the denegration of men ... I think it is a re-
allignment of history diferences which is a good thing especially the
empowerment of women, who are 51% of the population. There will
always be a place for men being men and women being women....
... and by god they do look fantastic with their curves and ... mmm
The only thing I do take offence at is the increasing (majority)
number of women presenting sport - Considering 95% of sport is
watched / supported by men I sometimes think it is a bit rich all these
female presenters ... but hey there you go... is that just a UK
phenomena?
A very thoughtful response. A couple of questions: what is BF?
Scondly, I am assuming that you are a woman. For the sake of
dialogue, what would you say are the most important and desirable
traits for a woman to find in a man? Didn't get any response from the
male side of the question. Kirk
I think that's a bit of a generalisation. Passiveness was very much encouraged in (enforced
on?) women in the past, but it isn't really a virtue any more than aggression is.
Suppose, through technology, no more boys were born in the UK and the population became
entirely female. If women all behaved in a 'feminine' way, none would join the army, in fact
many might be opposed to having an army in the first place. We would then be at the mercy
of other countries for military defence (no matter how peaceful Britain would be, there'd
always be nasty 'masculine' countries who'd try to exploit the situation). Science, maths and
engineering aren't considered very feminine as they are quite regimented and artificial, so
they would lose out to arts subjects at university, which are not generally as productive for
the economy. In short, women would be forced to become more 'masculine' in their
behaviour.
Don't get me wrong: an excessively masculine society, like Sparta or Nazi Germany, would
certainly come to a nasty end; I don't need to explain what vices men have. I think what has
actually happened is that men and women have come to more closely resemble each other -
we are heading towards an androgynous society. I don't see this as a bad thing at all.
If we rewind to when we lived in caves.It was then, we needed these
roles.We needed hunter gatherers;who would take risks.Who would
give anything up for the tribe.Nature gave them beards(barbarions).
We needed the carers back in the caves to attend to the wounded in
battle and protect the young offspring.
Now these roles are mostly redundant,we have terms like "house
husband",and "new man".
Mari
Er, sorry your wrong. Back when we lived 'in caves' both men and
women (if these gender roles were actually recognised) were of an
equal status and shared most tasks. The division of labour probably
only came about with the domestication of cattle allowing cows milk to
replace breast milk and therefore allow women to bear children more
often, and consequently lead them to remaining in the home. The
gender division in 'tribal' groups is a result of either androcentrism in
researchers, or through studying 'ethnic' groups whose social structure
was distorted by colonial intrusion and missionaries.
Mark