@Rajk999 saidWhat do you mean by 'successful'? Happy or wealthy or why not both?
I dont know what you call evidence. Most of these things can be established by being aware of your surroundings and watching what is going on with people. You dont need an expert or a national survey to tell you for example that people who go to school, have an education, marry later in life, have children after marriage, are generally more successful than those who dont. This is one pattern that Christians tend to follow.
@Torunn saidNever said it was simple. I just gave one example of how Christianity can positively impact on peoples decisions and success in life. There are certain basic things that lead to success that are timeless, and apply for thousands of years, and it is taught by many religions, not just Christianity. Things like hard work, dont beg for handouts, look after your family, be a faithful spouse, dont get caught up with bad company, dont chase material things. Religion is a good thing. The only exception I can think of is Islam.
It is not as simple as that. If we follow the patterns that people lived by hundreds of years ago, would that work today? We can't stop the time at a certain point in time to say: this is how it should be, let's do it that way. Things change, we change, always have done.
@Torunn saidHappy people tend to be some combination of, materially comfortable, healthy and socially secure. These are things that Christianity teaches people to do, and it comes from being faithful in relationships, generous with material things and working hard to acheive something. Wealthy is not a good word because it means excessively rich, which is the cause of unhappiness for some people.
What do you mean by 'successful'? Happy or wealthy or why not both?
@Rajk999 saidI still say, it is much more complicated than that. You don't have to be Christian to be a truly good person, and confessing to the Christian faith does not necessarily make you a better individual. We learn by observing the world around us and reading books that imposing a faith on others doesn't bring success. Swedes during the 19th century mainly emigrated to America because of extreme poverty and the Swedish Christian church was the last to give a helping hand to these poor people. The church was the first to condemn and punish and exclude and they only referred to Gods will when tragedies struck.
Happy people tend to be some combination of, materially comfortable, healthy and socially secure. These are things that Christianity teaches people to do, and it comes from being faithful in relationships, generous with material things and working hard to acheive something. Wealthy is not a good word because it means excessively rich, which is the cause of unhappiness for some people.
@Torunn saidNever did I say you have to be a Christian to be a good person, neither any of the stuff you wrote contradicts what I wrote. Of course atheists can be good people as well. However there is a marked difference in the success [which I already defined] of kids brought up in a stable religious environment vs one brought up in an unstable environment like broken / fatherless homes, promiscuous worldly parents. Please dont tell me the obvious. I know there are exceptions, and atheists can have stable homes, etc. I know that. Is it possible to generalize without you claiming that there are exceptions? I know that.
I still say, it is much more complicated than that. You don't have to be Christian to be a truly good person, and confessing to the Christian faith does not necessarily make you a better individual. We learn by observing the world around us and reading books that imposing a faith on others doesn't bring success. Swedes during the 19th century mainly emigrated to America becau ...[text shortened]... e first to condemn and punish and exclude and they only referred to Gods will when tragedies struck.
@Rajk999 saidWe have different view points that's all.
Never did I say you have to be a Christian to be a good person, neither any of the stuff you wrote contradicts what I wrote. Of course atheists can be good people as well. However there is a marked difference in the success [which I already defined] of kids brought up in a stable religious environment vs one brought up in an unstable environment like broken / fatherless hom ...[text shortened]... ow that. Is it possible to generalize without you claiming that there are exceptions? I know that.
@Torunn saidProbably living in different environments is the culprit. I have seen proof [I dont need to have an international team of experts to gather data and analyse and tell me] that a stable family life, ie both parents happily married, and with good values [often brought on by religion], lead to a higher rate of successful children.
We have different view points that's all.
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@Rajk999 saidI agree, I just don't want to involve religion which I don't think always produces nice people.
Probably living in different environments is the culprit. I have seen proof [I dont need to have an international team of experts to gather data and analyse and tell me] that a stable family life, ie both parents happily married, and with good values [often brought on by religion], lead to a higher rate of successful children.
@Very-Rusty saidIt does and I think we have ended our discussion. We agree to disagree.
Appears like a thread better suited for the Spirituality Forum.
-VR
@Torunn saidLol ... again, I have never used the word nice. I actually think religion produces lots of notnice people. They tend to be arrogant and selfish, strange enough.
I agree, I just don't want to involve religion which I don't think always produces nice people.
Religion helps to produce stable people [which is one criteria for success], and the reason is that God lays out for them a path which often leads to successful lives. Have you read Proverbs and Ecclesiasties? Its full of life lessons and good advice that is timeless.
@Rajk999 saidDid you know many people come to General Forum to get away from the Spirituality Forum, or do you even care???
Lol ... again, I have never used the word nice. I actually think religion produces lots of notnice people. They tend to be arrogant and selfish, strange enough.
Religion helps to produce stable people [which is one criteria for success], and the reason is that God lays out for them a path which often leads to successful lives. Have you read Proverbs and Ecclesiasties? Its full of life lessons and good advice that is timeless.
-VR
@Very-Rusty saidI think you need to tell that to the original poster in the OP .. the grifter who started it off with Islam. Then Arktoros continued with Christianity. I was just replying.
Did you know many people come to General Forum to get away from the Spirituality Forum, or do you even care???
-VR
@Rajk999 saidYou now sound like Trump when you don't like what is being said blame the other guy even though you were in on it too.
I think you need to tell that to the original poster in the OP .. the grifter who started it off with Islam. Then Arktoros continued with Christianity. I was just replying.
-VR