2 unfair bannings

Originally posted by Krb3710
are you saying that my claim that these were indeed two very talented players is a lie?

i think you should calm down a little. it is hard to misread wormwoods comment '...cheaters do lie.' in the way you just did.

rhp is not interested at all in banning honest players. read the threads of people complaining about the time it took blatant cheaters to ban. as far as cheating is concerned, you may trust your friends. as an outsider it is just as valid to assume, they could be cheaters who now started lying, too. even though they might be talented players - talent doesnt prohibit from cheating.

the only thing, you should do for your own sake: do the best-in-three analysis yourself. search the forum to find out. take twenty (or even more) more or less recent games of each and do it the way, it is described in some thread here.

you will at least find out, whether they are lying on the cheating part. but maybe they got banned for something else? two accounts use? does rhp give even a reason?

but i doubt you want to put so much time into researching whether your friends are cheaters...

Originally posted by wormwood
you're english. alzhaimer is german.

?

yes he moved to this country about 10 years ago now, would you like to see his ECF profile?

Originally posted by Krb3710
my point is that these players have both been banned for a crime they have not commited, what is the point?

Regardless of how well you play at the club, how much better than you they are, how much they taught you... if their numbers match engine play over and over and over and over they WILL be removed for using the engine.

Engines evaluate millions of positions, and think different than honest strong players. Perhaps they got lazy, relied on help from engines to ensure they didn't blunder.

Either way, they used engines if they match engines.

Sorry to burst your bubble, dude.

P-

Originally posted by Krb3710
yes he moved to this country about 10 years ago now, would you like to see his ECF profile?

...and brought a chess engine with him, or purchased it when he arrived.

Again, honest strong players play like humans. Engine users play like engines.

P-

Originally posted by Krb3710
they also placed many attack on engine users on RHP and Fantal I think was close to moving to gameknot anyway to avoid those kind of people

Unless something drastic has changed, that right there ^ is pretty darn funny.

no it isn't implied at all.
players can be very strong and still cheat. Weyerstrass apparently fell into this category.

bottom line is, RHP has its cheating detection protocols and thresholds, honed over a number of years and based on what it considers to be robust science, with a quite large margin of safety whereby, as previously said, borderline cases are unlikely to be banned. Miscarriages of justice might occur, as they do in a court of law, but RHP clearly considers the risk of them occurring to be acceptable when weighed against the alternative of allowing cheats unfettered on the site.

It's not in RHP's interest to ban people without very good cause. It's a subscription lost.

RHP clearly has evidence that these guys were cheating. The evidence required is set out in any number of other threads. Where is your evidence that they weren't? It seems to be circumstantial at best - and probably not even that good

Krb:

It seems you're assuming that because they're great players OTB, they would never cheat in CC.

While I'd say that being a good, honest OTB player probably correlates with being a good, honest CC player, one doesn't necessarily imply the other.

As it is, the computer analysis was probably pretty damning. RHP is glacially slow in banning cheaters, even blatant ones, so getting an RHP ban is like winning the Fields Medal of CC cheating. Mind you, I actually think this is a great system, because I'm the sort of bleeding-heart player who'd rather two cheats go free than one innocent player be banned.

Originally posted by Krb3710
it is implied by the line "judging on past bannings, I'm sure they were more than blatant cheaters."
i know they arent engine users because they are strong honest players, they also placed many attack on engine users on RHP and Fantal I think was close to moving to gameknot anyway to avoid those kind of people

well that's nice, they'll fit right in. as gameknot has always been the #1 sanctuary for known engine users.

Originally posted by Phlabibit

Either way, they used engines if they match engines.
Sorry to burst your bubble, dude.
P-

And if they didn't they shouldn't be wasting their time here; but rather signing up to play in the WC.

Originally posted by tmetzler
Unless something drastic has changed, that right there ^ is pretty darn funny.

Lol... go to GK to avoid engine use! That's like going to the beach to avoid the sand.

Originally posted by Krb3710
yes he moved to this country about 10 years ago now, would you like to see his ECF profile?

his ecf profile is irrelevant to whether he used engine here or not. I was just wondering.

Originally posted by Phlabibit
Lol... go to GK to avoid engine use! That's like going to the beach to avoid the sand.

That's what I was thinking, didn't know if things had changed in that cyborg wasteland. If anything that statement is more telling than their graphs.

Has anyone ever been banned for soemthing other than engine use? In my short time here I am only aware of bannings for this reason.

Originally posted by SmittyTime
Has anyone ever been banned for soemthing other than engine use? In my short time here I am only aware of bannings for this reason.

Yes.

his ecf profile is irrelevant to whether he used engine here or not

I'd be interested in seeing Alzheimer's ECF profile, if it's offered. Fantal's too, if offered. I've played them both, and knowing who they are would help my personal assessment of their play.

I should add of course, as others have, that RHP only bans when the evidence stacks as high as an elephant's eye. Even WGM Yelena Dembo got banned recently, albeit not from this site