Originally posted by DeityIt's fine to try different things out. What's not a good idea is to flit between opening systems without ever understanding any of them properly. It sounds as if the Sicilian's gone a bit stale for you so I think it's reasonable to try something else for a while and come back to it in a couple of months.
I know I know, its stupid to change openings, though I only wanted to play e5, never really did.
I think its good to learn the basic theory behind most openings anyway.
I have been playing the sicillian since I started andjust recently tried the caro kann, I love the position much much more.
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[quote="Leaadas"]
In the Caro, when playing the line
1. e4 c6
2. d4 d5
3. e5 Bf5
4 g4 ...
I belive main line is supposed to be Bd7 to prevent the move e6 from being played. [/quote]
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[quote="cmsMaster"]
Actually, ...Bg6 with ...e6 is the idea. [/quote]
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The move 4. g4 is briefly mentioned as a sideline in NCO.
There are two responses given, both leading to approximate equality (though the resulting positions in both lines are quite complicated).
Primary line: 4... Bd7 5. c4 h5 6. gxh5 Bf5 7. Nc3 e6 8.Nge2 Bg4 9. Qb3 Qb6
Secondary line: 4... Be4 5. f3 Bg6 6. e6 fxe6 7 Bd3
Since NCO is one of those encylopedia type opening books and was published in 1999, it would be nice if someone could quote an evaluation of the line from an opening book which is devoted to the Caro-Kann and was published more recently.
Originally posted by AlboMalapropFoozerPerhaps I'm wrong, but in my experience as white against the Caro-Kann after the moves 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 Bf5 4.g4 I have seen 4...Bg6 EVERY time. Of course, I only played that line a couple of times, generally opting for the mainline with 4.Nc3 e6 (EVERY time again) 5.g4 Bg6 (EVERY time), so they transposed. Of course, a lot of my opponents play the opening like 4 year olds - so it's quite possible that I'm wrong.
[quote="Leaadas"]
In the Caro, when playing the line
1. e4 c6
2. d4 d5
3. e5 Bf5
4 g4 ...
I belive main line is supposed to be Bd7 to prevent the move e6 from being played. [/quote]
[quote="cmsMaster"]
Actually, ...Bg6 with ...e6 is the idea. [/quote]
The move 4. g4 is briefly mentioned as a sideline in NCO.
There are two responses ...[text shortened]... line from an opening book which is devoted to the Caro-Kann and was published more recently.
Originally posted by cmsMasterAfter 4. Nc3, 4... e6 is the main line and certainly if then 5. g4, it would be silly for Black to respond with anything other than 5... Bg6. However, for those games where you played the immediate 4. g4 and your opponents responded with 4... Bg6, it would appear that you missed an opportunity to obtain an advantage via 5. e6.
Perhaps I'm wrong, but in my experience as white against the Caro-Kann after the moves 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 Bf5 4.g4 I have seen 4...Bg6 EVERY time. Of course, I only played that line a couple of times, generally opting for the mainline with 4.Nc3 e6 (EVERY time again) 5.g4 Bg6 (EVERY time), so they transposed. Of course, a lot of my opponents play the opening like 4 year olds - so it's quite possible that I'm wrong.
Each section of NCO was written by one of four titled players from England (Nunn, Burgess, Emms, Gallagher). The relevant section for this line was written by Gallagher. As he is a GM and has since written the book "Starting Out: The Caro-Kann" (2002), I would tend to trust his judgement more than that of your opponents.
Ok, just a little update.
I was stupid for leaving the sicillian, I just had some problems with it.
But I took up the Caro-Kann and I am doing great with it, for months now.
I let myself be put into a passive position with the siciallian, and the same type of thing can happen when playing the Caro but I avoid that types of situations now.
I love the Caro-Kann now.
Thanks guys.
Originally posted by cmsMasterBut 4....Be4 5.f3 Bg6 is almost the same position only with more weakened white k-side (due to pawn on f3).
Perhaps I'm wrong, but in my experience as white against the Caro-Kann after the moves 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 Bf5 4.g4 I have seen 4...Bg6 EVERY time. Of course, I only played that line a couple of times, generally opting for the mainline with 4.Nc3 e6 (EVERY time again) 5.g4 Bg6 (EVERY time), so they transposed. Of course, a lot of my opponents play the opening like 4 year olds - so it's quite possible that I'm wrong.
Did you mention which line of the Sicilian you play,,,,,,??
If you are finding you are getting passsive position playing the Sicilian you are either a) playing the wriong variation of the sicilian or b)probably playing it poorly. It is a massively complexopening with a great variety of positions and takes a great deal of time and efort and skill to platy hem well
Caro-Kann is relatively simpler to grasp and probably doesn't require as much effort to learn and play well.
Maybe I am talking nonsense...............I usually do!
Originally posted by najdorfslayerAgainst Caro-Kann you should know how to play against:
Did you mention which line of the Sicilian you play,,,,,,??
If you are finding you are getting passsive position playing the Sicilian you are either a) playing the wriong variation of the sicilian or b)probably playing it poorly. It is a massively complexopening with a great variety of positions and takes a great deal of time and efort and skill to much effort to learn and play well.
Maybe I am talking nonsense...............I usually do!
1) Panov attack - 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 cxd5 4.c4
2) Advance line with 4.Nc3 - 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 Bf5 4.Nc3
In my opinion these are the most dangerous options for white.
P.S. Maybe after 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 black can try something like 3...c5 or 3....g6!?
i'm a huge fan of 3...c5 in the advance.
1. e4 c6
2. d4 d5
3. e5 c5
This gives black basically an advance french without a pawn on e6 so the bishop is free
After 4. dxc5 then 4...e6 transposes to an advance french or 4...Nc6 for some fun.
If you're lucky they'll play Nf3 sometime before taking on c5 (there is no point in playing e6 until they take) and then you can play ...Bg4 and ...e6 and have a pretty good position if you ask me 😀
3...Bf5 is more complicated imo, but i might look into it soon. And yes the Panov and 3. Nc3 (main line?) are a lil rougher but the caro-kann is great
IT depends on how your opponent handles the Gambit. I much prefer the Scandanavian or Latvian as black to engergize the game, I have even played the ELephant gambit! Possibly take my opponent off balance. As with any risky opening, better know your subject matter!
Against the Sicilian, I will play the Smith-Morra gambit more often than not, just to take my opponent (hopefully) out of their normal terriftory.
Originally posted by wolftuneBig problem with Smith Morra is after
IT depends on how your opponent handles the Gambit. I much prefer the Scandanavian or Latvian as black to engergize the game, I have even played the ELephant gambit! Possibly take my opponent off balance. As with any risky opening, better know your subject matter!
Against the Sicilian, I will play the Smith-Morra gambit more often than not, just to take my opponent (hopefully) out of their normal terriftory.
1.e4 c5
2.d4 cxd4
3.c3 Nf6
Oooops you are in a c3 Sicilian and this is usually not really waht white wants
Originally posted by KorchI agree there are some sharp lines in the Caro-Kann but compared to the Sicilian I think it is easier to understand and play for an inexperienced player.
Against Caro-Kann you should know how to play against:
1) Panov attack - 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.exd5 cxd5 4.c4
2) Advance line with 4.Nc3 - 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 Bf5 4.Nc3
In my opinion these are the most dangerous options for white.
P.S. Maybe after 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 black can try something like 3...c5 or 3....g6!?