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  1. 20 Oct '06 21:23 / 2 edits
    I am currently playing a game where my opponent opened with 1.Nf3 and transposed into a KIA... it was hard to fight and is still in progress... I was wondering, whats the most dangerous transpositional device that can be employed by white? Is this 1.Nf3? or would you suggest something different?
    Edit: and to broaden the responses, what transpositional devices have you used with success? I know that as black there are more options... but I want to play them as white.

    And for some background, I usually play 1.e4 going into the lopez or the vienna gambit... what other systems or openings have common elements with these openings that I could learn in order to broaden my understanding of the positions that may arise from them?
  2. 20 Oct '06 23:18 / 1 edit
    O.k. as I say e4 e5 Nf3 Nc6 Bc4 Bc5 c3 Nf6 d4 exd4 e5 d5 Bb6 even position but after move 3 if black does anything else he's asking for trouble.
  3. 21 Oct '06 00:03
    Originally posted by jonzzzz
    O.k. as I say e4 e5 Nf3 Nc6 Bc4 Bc5 c3 Nf6 d4 exd4 e5 d5 Bb6 even position but after move 3 if black does anything else he's asking for trouble.
    of course...at move 3 he can just play the Two Knight's Defense (like me!)
  4. Subscriber Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    21 Oct '06 13:57
    Originally posted by ChessJester
    I am currently playing a game where my opponent opened with 1.Nf3 and transposed into a KIA... it was hard to fight and is still in progress... I was wondering, whats the most dangerous transpositional device that can be employed by white? Is this 1.Nf3? or would you suggest something different?
    Edit: and to broaden the responses, what transpositional d ...[text shortened]... at I could learn in order to broaden my understanding of the positions that may arise from them?
    I play 1.Nf3 and have found it to be a potent weapon! Black has to choose his system first and white is free to transpose into a miriad of favourable lines from pretty much any black responce. At the top levels (Grandmaster...) it has proven a little drawish and i think they prefer to stake a concrete claim for the center instead. At our level though, i think it is an excellent first move.
  5. Standard member thesonofsaul
    King of the Ashes
    21 Oct '06 15:12
    Originally posted by Sicilian Smaug
    Playing against 1.Nf3 has been given me headaches for a long time, but just lately I have tried transposing into a King's Indian as black by playing 1..g6 2.. Nf6 and 3..d6, seems to work quite well.
    I used to try 1..c5 hoping for 2 e4 and a Sicilian but white invariably plays 2. c4 into an English symmetrical.
    I agree. A hypermodern approach would probably work well for black, aiming weapons against the center without claiming it. Transposing into the KID or Pirc would work well, and if white refuses the center black is in position to claim it backed with good development.

    Another good stratagy for black would be aggressive play. The KIA is a bit timid and usually aims at closing the center with kingside attack potential. If black can claim space and open the game up a bit he stands pretty good. I used to play the KIA and this is the response that I had the most trouble with. If black moves with confidence then white loses initiative--I understand why it can be drawish in the upper echelons.
  6. 22 Oct '06 19:49
    If you like the KID do a3 as white so9 then your oponent can't do the Ruy Lopez reversed so they would do d5 and you do Nf3 and theirs your KIA
  7. 22 Oct '06 19:49
  8. 22 Oct '06 19:56
    Originally posted by jonzzzz
    If you like the KID do a3 as white so9 then your oponent can't do the Ruy Lopez reversed so they would do d5 and you do Nf3 and theirs your KIA
    I think i might have understood half of that....
  9. 22 Oct '06 20:07
  10. 22 Oct '06 20:08
    Originally posted by YUG0slav
    I think i might have understood half of that....
  11. Subscriber Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    22 Oct '06 20:34
    Originally posted by Sicilian Smaug
    Playing against 1.Nf3 has been given me headaches for a long time, but just lately I have tried transposing into a King's Indian as black by playing 1..g6 2.. Nf6 and 3..d6, seems to work quite well.
    I used to try 1..c5 hoping for 2 e4 and a Sicilian but white invariably plays 2. c4 into an English symmetrical.
    A studied player should have little problem with black taking this approach. It is possible to force black into statistically bad lines quite easily. I think youd be better off playing a slightly different move order. Bring the knight to f6 before ..g6 ..Bg7. You might as well claim the central squares and force white to play Nc3 to prepare e4, if you allow him to just throw the e'pawn straight out there you are giving him space with a tempo.

    I personally think 1..d6 is an excellent response for black as it is equally transpositional! You put the onus back on white to choose a system, as you can transpose into any number of openings from this position...sicillian, pirc, KID, lion...hell, if white plays to 2.e4 you can still play a ruy lopez
  12. Subscriber Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    22 Oct '06 21:19
    Originally posted by Sicilian Smaug
    I like the sound of d6, I shall check it out on Chessgames
    playing against the English is my other problem. Can't make up my mind how to tackle it still .
    Again 1..d6 is an excellent start! More often than not white will play 2.d4, at which point 2..e5! has great potential. If white swaps Queens then black has some 60% win percentage. Itàs a great line to learn. Check it out on shredder database...

    http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/opening-database.html

    If white sticks to his English plans, you can get a good game with a c6, d6, e5 pawnstructure. Again shredder is a nice quick reference...
  13. 22 Oct '06 21:28
    Originally posted by Sicilian Smaug
    I like the sound of d6, I shall check it out on Chessgames
    playing against the English is my other problem. Can't make up my mind how to tackle it still .
    I've been playing an interesting variation against the English recently.

    1.c4 d5 The point, of course, is to transpose if white lets me.
    2.d4 c6 Slav - I use the Semi-Slav which I should be into in a couple moves now.

    or

    2.Nc3 c6 - More potential to transpose into the Semi-Slav.

    or

    2.cxd5 c6 - A reversed Smith-Morra Gambit that I've had pretty good results with in the few games I've played. It seems black gets compensation for the pawn and I can't imagine that white is prepared for the resulting lines. Of course, if you don't want to gambit the pawn 2...Qxd5 is possible, but doesn't really seem any better.
  14. 22 Oct '06 21:41
    Originally posted by Sicilian Smaug
    playing against the English is my other problem. Can't make up my mind how to tackle it still .
    I HAVE THAT PROBLEM TOO!
  15. 23 Oct '06 00:13
    do f5 against d4 and transpose into dutch I know all the lines as black