Originally posted by Eladar
The National Science Foundation has not political objectives? How is it funded? How does it get money? Why would it need more funding?

Having possible political objectives does not equate with having some kind of shameless dishonest effort to make a bias poll. Most people have a moral conscience with psychopaths being a minority of most groups of people and so far I have seen no evidence that the majority of those at the NSF are any different. Most people would actually find it quite psychologically hard to actually do something as dishonest as that. I for one, for example, would not be motivated to make a deliberately biased poll, nor deliberately designed it so that it could be merely more easily 'inadvertently' prone to bias, even if I knew for certain I would get a million pound for it -it is the moral conscience that gets in the way you see.

So, as I see it, the default assumption must be that, unless you have specific evidence to believe otherwise, if, hypothetically, the poll really is biased, it probably wasn't deliberately so and the NSF probably would have made an honest genuine effort to not make it biased EVEN with any political motive they may have to want a particular result from that poll.

Originally posted by KazetNagorra
That may be (I haven't investigated the dynamics of the Solar system in detail). Still, the center of gravity of the Sun and of the Solar system will practically never be identical.

Agreed. Most likely never.

Originally posted by Eladar
It is my observation that pollsters will attempt to take a sample which has the best chance of getting the desired results.

Polls are not cheap and are instigated mainly for information rather than propaganda (although they may subsequently be hijacked for propaganda).
So I am interested in your observations.

Examples?

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Polls are not cheap and are instigated mainly for information rather than propaganda (although they may subsequently be hijacked for propaganda).
So I am interested in your observations.

Examples?

I am afraid I already asked him for specific examples. He rather revealingly gave none. So don't hold your breath for that one.

Originally posted by Eladar
The National Science Foundation has not political objectives? How is it funded? How does it get money? Why would it need more funding?

The main purpose of the NSF is to fund research. Most (all?) of the NSF's money comes from the federal government.

Originally posted by KazetNagorra
The main purpose of the NSF is to fund research. Most (all?) of the NSF's money comes from the federal government.

The the perceived need for increased science the more money that they will get.

Originally posted by Eladar
The the perceived need for increased science the more money that they will get.

The NSF just grants the money that it receives from the federal government. The federal government would have an incentive to make it seem that its education system is doing well.

Originally posted by KazetNagorra
The NSF just grants the money that it receives from the federal government. The federal government would have an incentive to make it seem that its education system is doing well.

In the US money goes to where it appears to be needed. The lower the educational outcome, the more money is needed to bring results.

Originally posted by Eladar
In the US money goes to where it appears to be needed. The lower the educational outcome, the more money is needed to bring results.

NSF funding goes towards research. The people who receive NSF funding already know basic astronomy. The people who don't know basic astronomy won't see a dime of NSF funding. If the federal government wants to increase overall basic knowledge of astronomy, they would be better off improving high school education rather than funding top research.

Originally posted by KazetNagorra
NSF funding goes towards research. The people who receive NSF funding already know basic astronomy. The people who don't know basic astronomy won't see a dime of NSF funding. If the federal government wants to increase overall basic knowledge of astronomy, they would be better off improving high school education rather than funding top research.

All that matters is perception. If science is perceived to be needed, then science gets more money. It doesn't matter if the money is funded to the correct area, science funding is science funding.

Originally posted by Eladar
In the US money goes to where it appears to be needed. The lower the educational outcome, the more money is needed to bring results.

Since NSF doesn't receive funding for the education system, it has nothing to financially gain, at least not directly and in the short term, from persuading government to give more funding for the education system because, if the government did give more funding for the education system, the NSF will not get any of it.
Thus the NSF have no financially incentive for giving a biased poll to make out that people need better education. I still wouldn't rule out the possibility of inadvertent bias in that poll, but, if that was the reason why you think that the poll could be biased (either inadvertently biased or deliberately biased ), your reasoning doesn't make any sense.

If the NSF really wanted to get more funding AND was dishonest enough to be prepared to make a biased poll (which we should assume, by default, to be very unlikely! Most people have a moral conscience and would actually find doing that quite hard to do! ) to get more funding, they wouldn't make the poll about how stupid people are (because that wouldn't help one bit! ) but rather I would guess they would make the poll about something like how many top research scientists think they observe a serious and crippling shortage of funding for extremely important research and then bias the results to make out a hugely large percentage think this.
But that is not what they have done so a desire for more funding couldn't be a possible reason for bias.

Originally posted by humy
At first I thought this must be a joke but this doesn't look like a joke! :

http://phys.org/news/2014-02-americans-unaware-earth-circles-sun.html

"...Americans are enthusiastic about the promise of science but lack basic knowledge of it, with one in four unaware that the Earth revolves around the Sun, said a poll out Friday.

The survey included more th ...[text shortened]... ers, and about the same number expressed interest in learning about medical discoveries.

..."

I weep for my countrymen when I hear this kind of thing.

Originally posted by Suzianne
I weep for my countrymen when I hear this kind of thing.

Don't worry about it. This poll is bogus, anyway. It is something like what they put on the old Tonight Show with Jay Leno for comedy.

Originally posted by RJHinds
Don't worry about it. This poll is bogus, anyway. It is something like what they put on the old Tonight Show with Jay Leno for comedy.

Only you would think it funny that people can be so ignorant. But that is your goal, keep people ignorant and afraid of the dark so your real agenda can get going.

Originally posted by sonhouse
Only you would think it funny that people can be so ignorant. But that is your goal, keep people ignorant and afraid of the dark so your real agenda can get going.

It is always funny when Jay Leno does it. You are just an angry old man with very little sense of humor.