@KellyJay saidLook up dendrochronoly.
We have been tracking temperatures for the earth for a few thousand years? We only have recorded human history for how long?
The technique is to evaluate growth rings of trees (and ancient wood beams and so on). At least for the living trees I can't think of any substantial critique, but I am open to hear you.
@Ponderable saidWe are talking about monitoring planetary temperatures and coming up with a means by which we can look at the Earth and see it rise and fall thermally with trends, extrapolating what took place based on tree rings, from that we can know the temperatures for the whole planet historically. To be clear what is your argument? Because of tree rings, we can and should right now put a tax on cows, because they fart, producing a gas that poses a threat to the environment? This is science for you?
Look up dendrochronoly.
The technique is to evaluate growth rings of trees (and ancient wood beams and so on). At least for the living trees I can't think of any substantial critique, but I am open to hear you.
@KellyJay saidThe science is to derive a reasonable temperature profile from tree rings, which is a proven technique (at least for about the last 150 years). And extrapolation is a good technique as long as the fundamentals are clear.
We are talking about monitoring planetary temperatures and coming up with a means by which we can look at the Earth and see it rise and fall thermally with trends, extrapolating what took place based on tree rings, from that we can know the temperatures for the whole planet historically. To be clear what is your argument? Because of tree rings, we can and should right now ...[text shortened]... because they fart, producing a gas that poses a threat to the environment? This is science for you?
You fail to give the answer what "substantial" time means for you.
@Ponderable saidSome people who would look at patterns of how bones landed on an animal's skin, would call out what they said the bones were showing them after they threw them, that has as much falsifiable information as what you can tell me about temperatures hundreds of years ago from a tree ring. People are being taxed, industries are being regulated over things like this, and you call these acceptable ways to do science to come up with the truth about global thermodynamic changes over time.
The science is to derive a reasonable temperature profile from tree rings, which is a proven technique (at least for about the last 150 years). And extrapolation is a good technique as long as the fundamentals are clear.
You fail to give the answer what "substantial" time means for you.
Doing a temperature study testing the CPU was much more accurate, how much work could be done where would cause T rise, should the processor design put these internal components here or there while it operates before we induce thermal issues, you can look at a tree ring and know what the planet had going on, amazing.
@KellyJay saidSo your beef is with taxes. OK. No science involved.
Some people who would look at patterns of how bones landed on an animal's skin, would call out what they said the bones were showing them after they threw them, that has as much falsifiable information as what you can tell me about temperatures hundreds of years ago from a tree ring. People are being taxed, industries are being regulated over things like this, and you call ...[text shortened]... e induce thermal issues, you can look at a tree ring and know what the planet had going on, amazing.
However this is the science Forum, so the observation is that the glaciers in Alsaka are melting, the velocity of the melt has increased in the last few decades.
Now are you doubting this ovbservation?
@Ponderable saidThe truth sets us free if what you are claiming is true we need to know it, but follow the money rule by agendas, and as I said, regulations, and taxes give power, control, and wealth. How sure are you that when we look at it tree rings we are actually accurately measuring planet temperatures over thousands of years?
So your beef is with taxes. OK. No science involved.
However this is the science Forum, so the observation is that the glaciers in Alsaka are melting, the velocity of the melt has increased in the last few decades.
Now are you doubting this ovbservation?
@KellyJay
Yes indeed I am quite satisfied with the underlying model and it's verfictaion over the time we do have temperature measurements (about 200 years)
@Ponderable saidHow do you get a global temperature right now that you trust, what is the means?
@KellyJay
Yes indeed I am quite satisfied with the underlying model and it's verfictaion over the time we do have temperature measurements (about 200 years)
@KellyJay
Read this
https://report.ipcc.ch/ar6/wg1/IPCC_AR6_WGI_FullReport.pdf
bearing in mkind that something as a "global" temperature" needs to be modeled and can't estimted using single measurement points.
Please suggest a different model witha good reasoning and I might accept that.
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@sonhouse saidIt is caused by the planet warming after the mini ice age probably caused by the volcanic winter of 538. Natural causes.
https://phys.org/news/2024-07-alaska-heavy-glaciers-approaching-irreversible.html
Just think, all this from just weather, couldn't POSSIBLY be from man made increase in greenhouse gasses could it?
There is no evidence CO2 causes temp increase. The evidence shows the opposite is true in the ice core samples. Temps cause CO2 and methane levels to rise. That is a fact.
@Metal-Brain
You want to keep living in la la land, the evidence is overwhelming more CO2, it gets hotter and there is nothing you can say to counter that, unless you are going to refer to your 90 year old climatologist who said that.
The real world went WAY past that dude.
@sonhouse saidThat is a lie. There is no evidence of that at all.
@Metal-Brain
You want to keep living in la la land, the evidence is overwhelming more CO2, it gets hotter and there is nothing you can say to counter that, unless you are going to refer to your 90 year old climatologist who said that.
The real world went WAY past that dude.
CO2 levels lagged behind temps in the ice core samples. FACT
You have your cause and effect backwards son.
@Ponderable saidI would like to see how the measurements are being done, can you give me a page number... it reads like everything is just assumed true and there should be no issues with the details.
@KellyJay
Read this
https://report.ipcc.ch/ar6/wg1/IPCC_AR6_WGI_FullReport.pdf
bearing in mkind that something as a "global" temperature" needs to be modeled and can't estimted using single measurement points.
Please suggest a different model witha good reasoning and I might accept that.
@KellyJay
You clearly don't WANT to know about how that conclusion was reached, here is a NASA report on exactly how that data got shown:
https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/carbon-dioxide/?intent=121
But I suppose the agency I used to work for is all corrupt and not a good source.
But I know better, having actually worked for them at Goddard Space Flight Center.
They are after truth, not some politically and financially motivated BS designed to allow more drilling of oil, more burning of coal which is exactly what YOUR buddy Trump will do if by some inexplicable chance he is reelected.
BTW, how can you as a Christian support a dude who screwed a porn star the month his own wife was having his baby?
Do you now throw the ten commandments out the window? Exodus 20:15, "thou shall not commit adultery: .
Are you saying fuuking a porn star when his wife was having his own baby is now NOT adultery?
Sorry, just a side note.
@sonhouse saidAs soon as you invoke Trump’s name I quit listening to you as you stopped listening to me, I am not a Trump apologist you are just spewing nonsense hate now.
@KellyJay
You clearly don't WANT to know about how that conclusion was reached, here is a NASA report on exactly how that data got shown:
https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/carbon-dioxide/?intent=121
But I suppose the agency I used to work for is all corrupt and not a good source.
But I know better, having actually worked for them at Goddard Space Flight Center.
T ...[text shortened]... g a porn star when his wife was having his own baby is now NOT adultery?
Sorry, just a side note.