11 Jan 20
@humy saidEverything I wrote in that post is true and accurate. It isn't my fault you reject facts.
There would be absolutely no point in either him or the rest of us 'understanding' a single one of your many clearly false assertions.
First you need to actually learn something about what you are talking about. Only then might we listen.
11 Jan 20
@metal-brain saidNo, it isn't. It is mostly contrary to what the science says.
Everything I wrote in that post is true and accurate.
11 Jan 20
@metal-brain saidTime dilation is a consequence of Lorentz invariance and occurs in flat spacetime just as it does in curved spacetime. You've got it all wrong once again, I'm afraid.
You describe something 4 dimensional with a two dimensional description and then you use a 4 dimensional description (space-time). I think you are failing to understand time dilation is part of space-time.
Time dilation (1 dimension) bends space (3 dimensions). 3+1=4 dimensions = space-time.
Time dilation and the bending of space-time are the same thing. You need to ...[text shortened]... d simply be called "space". add the time dilation and you have space-time.
Now do you understand?
11 Jan 20
@metal-brain saidI'm afraid not. I've been working on the assumption that by gravity we mean the tendency of objects to fall towards massive bodies. This is explainable in terms of clock rates. What is not explainable in this way is the tendency of gyroscopes near rotating massive bodies, such as a rotating black hole, to start precessing. So space-time curvature is not just a matter of clocks running slower distorting space-time.
You describe something 4 dimensional with a two dimensional description and then you use a 4 dimensional description (space-time). I think you are failing to understand time dilation is part of space-time.
Time dilation (1 dimension) bends space (3 dimensions). 3+1=4 dimensions = space-time.
Time dilation and the bending of space-time are the same thing. You need to ...[text shortened]... d simply be called "space". add the time dilation and you have space-time.
Now do you understand?
The Wikipedia page relevant to this is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lense-Thirring_precession
11 Jan 20
@kazetnagorra saidHe means gravitational time dilation. His point here isn't that bad, it's just he's trying to do something along the lines of Socratic Questioning without the necessary experience and knowledge and in some sort of spirit of oneupmanship so the discussion tends to be eristic instead of constructive.
Time dilation is a consequence of Lorentz invariance and occurs in flat spacetime just as it does in curved spacetime. You've got it all wrong once again, I'm afraid.
12 Jan 20
@deepthought saidWhy would gravity result in time dilation? If you have the necessary experience you can answer the question.
He means gravitational time dilation. His point here isn't that bad, it's just he's trying to do something along the lines of Socratic Questioning without the necessary experience and knowledge and in some sort of spirit of oneupmanship so the discussion tends to be eristic instead of constructive.
@metal-brain saidnot necessarily in a way you can understand. And I suspect you are incapable of understanding it, not so much because of your lack of intellect but more because you resist anything that is contrary to your personal opinions and also your lack of real curiosity and, just like you have repeatedly demonstrated here, your general unwillingness to truly listen and learn from people that know things you don't. Instead, all you want to do is just argue against and 'win the argument' against the experts here. So for you here it isn't about learning but just futile angry arguing.
If you have the necessary experience you can answer the question.
I on the other hand have the opposite attitude;
I sometimes ask questions here to learn from people smarter than me that know things I don't.
I sometimes have learned from one of the experts here (and you are CERTAINLY not one of them and I have never learned anything from you) and that I was wrong about something (but NEVER from you) and thus change my opinion about something and thus actually learn something new from talking to the experts here. Why don't you ever do that?
@humy saidI was not asking you. Your opinion is irrelevant. You cannot answer the question either. That is evident.
not necessarily in a way you can understand. And I suspect you are incapable of understanding it, not so much because of your lack of intellect but more because you resist anything that is contrary to your personal opinions and also your lack of real curiosity and, just like you have repeatedly demonstrated here, your general unwillingness to truly listen and learn from people t ...[text shortened]... and thus actually learn something new from talking to the experts here. Why don't you ever do that?
12 Jan 20
@metal-brain saidI'm not attempting Socratic Questioning.
Why would gravity result in time dilation? If you have the necessary experience you can answer the question.
13 Jan 20
@deepthought saidIn other words, you have no answer. You expect people to believe time dilation is the result of gravity for no apparent reason. That is a very deep flaw in your reasoning. Do you expect us to believe Einstein made up some BS about time dilation resulting from gravity for no reason?
I'm not attempting Socratic Questioning.
Einstein's GR is based on time dilation causing gravitational attraction, not the other way around. Brian Greene understands GR well enough to realize that. I'm sure that in time you will realize that as well. You will just have to live in denial for a while since you are so dogmatic.
13 Jan 20
@metal-brain saidAssuming by gravity we mean the tendency of objects to fall towards massive objects I didn't say that. Gravitational time dilation is the result of observers whose clocks are running at different rates making observations at different points in a gravitational field.
In other words, you have no answer. You expect people to believe time dilation is the result of gravity for no apparent reason. That is a very deep flaw in your reasoning. Do you expect us to believe Einstein made up some BS about time dilation resulting from gravity for no reason?
Einstein's GR is based on time dilation causing gravitational attraction, not the other ...[text shortened]... ll realize that as well. You will just have to live in denial for a while since you are so dogmatic.
13 Jan 20
@deepthought saidYou are evading my question.
Assuming by gravity we mean the tendency of objects to fall towards massive objects I didn't say that. Gravitational time dilation is the result of observers whose clocks are running at different rates making observations at different points in a gravitational field.
Why would gravity result in time dilation?
13 Jan 20
@metal-brain saidIf you really want to know, why don't you just look it up over the net?
You are evading my question.
Why would gravity result in time dilation?
Since you moronically deny that he is an expert, why ask him?
He might be willing to answer such a general question if he thought you really wanted to know. The problem is, you don't.
13 Jan 20
@Metal-Brain
Jebesus, He just fukking TOLD you. You seem to have a great difficulty putting meaning of words together in a string. You are like seeing individual words with no connection to the next.
13 Jan 20
@sonhouse saidAre you stupid? He did nothing of the sort. This is what he said:
@Metal-Brain
Jebesus, He just fukking TOLD you. You seem to have a great difficulty putting meaning of words together in a string. You are like seeing individual words with no connection to the next.
"Gravitational time dilation is the result of observers whose clocks are running at different rates making observations at different points in a gravitational field."
He said time dilation is the result of the difference in proper time. That difference in proper time is time dilation. He did NOT explain why gravity would cause time dilation.
He is being evasive because he has no answer and you are being gullible. He gave me a BS non answer to my question and he knows it. Now you do too.