3:1 Now the serpent was more subtle...

Originally posted by karoly aczel
Christ is a Lord. I'm cool with that. A lord of himself,(his own mind), and not a subjagator of people.

Christ is a Lord.
No, not a lord, the Lord. Beeg difference.

I'm cool with that.
I'm sure He's relieved.

A lord of himself,(his own mind), and not a subjagator of people.
Wrong on both accounts.
God is not God of Himself: the idea is preposterous.
God does not enslave anyone. The fact that He is creator of all that is created, by default, subjects any aspect of that creation to Him.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]Christ is a Lord.
No, not a lord, the Lord. Beeg difference.

I'm cool with that.
I'm sure He's relieved.

A lord of himself,(his own mind), and not a subjagator of people.
Wrong on both accounts.
God is not God of Himself: the idea is preposterous.
God does not enslave anyone. The fact that He is creator of all that is created, by default, subjects any aspect of that creation to Him.[/b]

1. Chist is A Lord. Not the only Lord. (imo)

2.I dont think He's relieved with that. I think,if he is what I think He is made out to be, that he is far from relieved by my own and others attitudes.

3.Are we talking about Jesus or God here? You've lost me

Originally posted by karoly aczel
1. Chist is A Lord. Not the only Lord. (imo)

2.I dont think He's relieved with that. I think,if he is what I think He is made out to be, that he is far from relieved by my own and others attitudes.

3.Are we talking about Jesus or God here? You've lost me

1. Chist is A Lord. Not the only Lord. (imo)
And everyone is entitled to theirs. However, you may want to see if your opinions square with the facts. In this case, they clearly do not.

2.I dont think He's relieved with that. I think,if he is what I think He is made out to be, that he is far from relieved by my own and others attitudes.
My post was sarcasm. Nonetheless, He is totally relaxed, either way.

3.Are we talking about Jesus or God here? You've lost me
The Lord Jesus Christ is God... we call Him God the Son. One of three members of the Trinity which we know as God.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]1. Chist is A Lord. Not the only Lord. (imo)
And everyone is entitled to theirs. However, you may want to see if your opinions square with the facts. In this case, they clearly do not.

2.I dont think He's relieved with that. I think,if he is what I think He is made out to be, that he is far from relieved by my own and others attitudes.
M ...[text shortened]... is God... we call Him God the Son. One of three members of the Trinity which we know as God.[/b]

Your arrogance astounds me.

1.What facts are you talking about?Christian facts? Biblical facts? Are all other religons wrong and christianity right? (Because that it what you are clearly trying to say, which reeks of short-sightedness and one-upmanship)

2.I knew your post was sarcasm. Really , I thought it was out of place and not in the spirit of the debate.

3.You just make Jesus into what ever you want to suit your arguement.

I believe I was making some remarks about my own spiritual experiences on this thread when you bullied your way into my train of thought. I never said Christianity was not a valid Way. I never dissed Jesus,(in fact I agreed that he is one of the Lords amongst men). Yet that is not enough for you. You need to show me how wrong I am. That my opinions are not in accord with facts. My opinions ARE in accord with the facts of my life.
This is about as mean as I get, but I think you should be a bit more humble and open-minded.
I'm sure there are other Christians here that may take your side so you feel like you can just bulldoze your way through my views. Let me tell you Freaky, you are achieving exactly the opposite of what it is you are trying to achieve. Do you think I care if not even one other person in the whole world agrees with me? The only one I have to face is God at the end of the day,(thank God), and not nay-sayers like you😛

Originally posted by karoly aczel
Your arrogance astounds me.

1.What facts are you talking about?Christian facts? Biblical facts? Are all other religons wrong and christianity right? (Because that it what you are clearly trying to say, which reeks of short-sightedness and one-upmanship)

2.I knew your post was sarcasm. Really , I thought it was out of place and not in the spirit o ...[text shortened]... only one I have to face is God at the end of the day,(thank God), and not nay-sayers like you😛

Your arrogance astounds me.
And your ignorance induces my gag reflex. Hell, we can get alliterative until the cows come home, but are we really making any head way? I think not.

1.What facts are you talking about?Christian facts? Biblical facts? Are all other religons wrong and christianity right? (Because that it what you are clearly trying to say, which reeks of short-sightedness and one-upmanship)
The discussion was relative to your comments on the who and the what of the person we call Jesus Christ. As of this writing, there is precious little to nothing about those concerns in any source, save one: the Bible.

2.I knew your post was sarcasm. Really , I thought it was out of place and not in the spirit of the debate.
You are absolutely right: I should stay on topic. However, when a statement is made that so counters basic reason as to warrant correction, don't each of us have a duty to divert long enough to make those necessary corrections?

You're welcome?

3.You just make Jesus into what ever you want to suit your arguement.
Nah. I'll let the Bible inform me, thanks. I've twisted reality enough in my life to know it's a fool's paradise. After causing as much destruction as said perspective allowed, I finally wised up and submitted myself to His system, His truth. I highly recommend doing so to any person who loves the truth.

I believe I was making some remarks about my own spiritual experiences on this thread when you bullied your way into my train of thought.
Big, mean ol' me. Next time, before you let the train leave the station, you should check to see if the conductor's shown up for his shift.

I never said Christianity was not a valid Way. I never dissed Jesus,(in fact I agreed that he is one of the Lords amongst men).
I realize this is hard for you to believe, but what you insist you aren't saying is exactly what you are saying by virtue of your inaccurate use of a simple little indefinite article.

Imagine it this way. Suppose I am the highest rated player on this site. Suppose you and I are discussing my status as such.
You could say, "Yo, crazy FreakyKBH, you certainly are a highly-rated player here."
I would modestly counter, "Yes, karoly, it is true: I am a highly-rated player here. However, karoly, more than that, I am the highest rated player here."
You come back with, "That rating you have certainly is higher than most people here."
I again modestly point out, "Karoly, I am higher than everyone here."

In this scenario, you have not once acknowledged what I have said about myself. Modesty does not diminish the fact that I am, indeed, the highest rated player here, but you adamantly refuse to acknowledge this status, instead you speak about my chess prowess in wholly subjective terms--- without ever agreeing with me about me. This is exactly what you do with the Lord Jesus Christ with your =pathetic= stabs at placating who-knows-what-sensibilities by (again) your inaccurate use of an indefinite article. He didn't think of Himself as an 'a,' but instead, as 'the.'

My opinions ARE in accord with the facts of my life.
I am starting to feel the most unusually warm and fuzzy feelings I have ever hoped to feel. Please, tell me more!

This is about as mean as I get, but I think you should be a bit more humble and open-minded.
Don't sell yourself short, you're a tremendous slouch.

I'm sure there are other Christians here that may take your side so you feel like you can just bulldoze your way through my views.
I couldn't give a rat's ass if anyone here takes 'my' side. I'm either in line with the truth, or I'm not. You're so concerned about being true to yourself, but don't stop to consider that in doing so, you're bastardizing yourself from the truth, from reality. Newsflash: you can't bend reality. You can live in that bubble as long as it doesn't interfere with cause-and-effect (or, in some cases, continue doing so well after the fact), but eventually and inevitably, the truth shines.

Let me tell you Freaky, you are achieving exactly the opposite of what it is you are trying to achieve.
What is that, exactly?

The only one I have to face is God at the end of the day,(thank God), and not nay-sayers like you😛
Finally! We're in agreement. There's hope yet.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]Your arrogance astounds me.
And your ignorance induces my gag reflex. Hell, we can get alliterative until the cows come home, but are we really making any head way? I think not.

1.What facts are you talking about?Christian facts? Biblical facts? Are all other religons wrong and christianity right? (Because that it what you are clearly tryin ...[text shortened]... ou😛
Finally! We're in agreement. There's hope yet.[/b]

There's hope yet is there? for me and my soul ,no doubt.

What a nice,long counter your post was.
You have set yourself against me as you have set yourself against reality and God.

You let the bible inform you, do you? Well thats great. If its working for you just keep at it. Sounds like a nice piece of literature.

I let my own experience inform me first and foremostly, then comes religous books and what others have to say,etc.

When I tell you that my opinions are in accord with the facts of my life, you make the most sarcastic comment of them all. Do you really expect me to open up?

I'm a tremendous slouch...I'm bastardizing myself from the truth...I live in a bubble...and on and on. You dont know crap about me and if you did you would have more respect than those type of comments.Yes indeed, Freaky. Be humble. Snap out of it!!!

You go furthur to achieving the opposite of what it is you are trying to achieve. What you dont know what that is? Why you seem to know everything else.

I've just had a couple of good exchanges with jaywill and kelly jay. Both Christians.But both with a good sense of where that fine line is with human to human communication. Your use of sarcasm and subtle put-downs are totally out of place and I think if you dont know what I mean here I will explain that one.

I'm actually a very sensetive person who has a bit more self-control than average. Thats just a clue about me if you want to engage me in the future.

All the best.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
There's hope yet is there? for me and my soul ,no doubt.

What a nice,long counter your post was.
You have set yourself against me as you have set yourself against reality and God.

You let the bible inform you, do you? Well thats great. If its working for you just keep at it. Sounds like a nice piece of literature.

I let my own experience info ...[text shortened]... verage. Thats just a clue about me if you want to engage me in the future.

All the best.

There's hope yet is there? for me and my soul ,no doubt.
I couldn't tell you. I was referring to the fact that we agreed on something which can be substantiated by outside sources, and therefore, the possibility remains that you haven't completely isolated yourself from reality.

You have set yourself against me as you have set yourself against reality and God.
Um, I know you are, what am I? Really, this is your retort? Why not just say "Uhn-uh" and plug your ears?

You let the bible inform you, do you? Well thats great. If its working for you just keep at it. Sounds like a nice piece of literature.
When it comes to spiritual matters, it sets itself against all other sources. I submit to it not because it works for me--- I certainly don't use myself as the measure of truth--- I submit to it because it is the truth.

I let my own experience inform me first and foremostly, then comes religous books and what others have to say,etc.
Hell, you're not the first, and you certainly won't be the last. Take it from another person so convinced: the outcome ain't pretty. You are essentially saying that you are the ultimate truth. Ever have a bad day, a foul mood, a series of unfortunate events? Have any of the same ever influenced your thinking, your decisions, your course of action? If you answered yes to any of the previous six scenarios, I welcome you to the human race and caution your from putting too much confidence in yourself.

When I tell you that my opinions are in accord with the facts of my life, you make the most sarcastic comment of them all. Do you really expect me to open up?
My bad: I didn't realize this was sharing time. Okay, my turn. Once, I crapped my pants and hid it in the attic so my folks wouldn't find out. When my deed went undiscovered, I decided the attic would become my repository for any future accidents. Everything went fine that winter...

I'm a tremendous slouch...
Uh, that's a quote from Caddyshack. I just figured it was appropriate to your views on how I should change.

I'm bastardizing myself from the truth...
Okay, that one was true.

I live in a bubble...and on and on.
So was that one.

You dont know crap about me and if you did you would have more respect than those type of comments.
Not true. You've shared a significant amount of crap with me so far.

Yes indeed, Freaky. Be humble. Snap out of it!!!
Humility is orientation to the truth. I don't snap out of it, I snap to it.
You really ought to try it some time: it's a blast!

Why you seem to know everything else.
No, but I do have a pretty firm grasp of the basics.

I've just had a couple of good exchanges with jaywill and kelly jay. Both Christians.But both with a good sense of where that fine line is with human to human communication. Your use of sarcasm and subtle put-downs are totally out of place and I think if you dont know what I mean here I will explain that one.
Sure, I hear you. I'm sarcastic, and that bothers you. I get it. I'm sure you're finding your way through the mine field just fine, nonetheless.
However, you mention how much you enjoy your "good exchanges" with jaywill. Was this one of the exchanges you enjoyed?

I think you are one of the people that the less you read the New Testament the more you consider yourself an expert on it.

I dunno. Just seems a tad too sarcastic (in my most humble of all human opinions) to be compatible with human to human communication. Maybe I'm wrong. I probably am.

I'm actually a very sensetive person who has a bit more self-control than average. Thats just a clue about me if you want to engage me in the future.
I'll be certain to punctuate my every sentence with plenty of 'kinda,' 'I really think,' and 'just seems,' whenever possible in the future, in addition to making as many appeals to nebulous feelings of fuzziness and warmth.

I really think that it just kinda seems only sensitive to do so.

All the better than average.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]There's hope yet is there? for me and my soul ,no doubt.
I couldn't tell you. I was referring to the fact that we agreed on something which can be substantiated by outside sources, and therefore, the possibility remains that you haven't completely isolated yourself from reality.

You have set yourself against me as you have set yourself again a seems only sensitive to do so.

All the better than average.

1. What is there hope for? Me becoming a christian,perhaps?

2.I try to be honest about being separated from God and about the journey to reunify. But I also could've said,"I know you are but what am I",I suppose.

3.So the bible is the truth and other religous books aren't, right? And why is that so exactly?

4.Thnx for the welcome to the human race. God beat you to it by about 12 or 13 years.

5.Hehehe🙂 . Maybe you should stick to entertainment. You make more headway that way.

6.So you

7.Really dont mind

8.Calling me names? And judging me?

9.You know crap all. But if you think you do just carry on like you are king. I'm sure you know how effective that will be.

10.Ok then. SNAP INTO IT!!

11.The basics of what? Christian one-upmanship?

12.Sarcastic at the wrong times. Yes that was a good line from jaywill. In keeping witth the spirit of my origonal claim.

13.You really dont seem to care. But wait...you claim that...Hang on a minute...you said that...

Perhaps we will have to let the forum decide who is the winner of this one. Like the one between sharky and carrobie on the @Robie Carrobie thread. We all know how well that one went down.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
1. What is there hope for? Me becoming a christian,perhaps?

2.I try to be honest about being separated from God and about the journey to reunify. But I also could've said,"I know you are but what am I",I suppose.

3.So the bible is the truth and other religous books aren't, right? And why is that so exactly?

4.Thnx for the welcome to the human ...[text shortened]... sharky and carrobie on the @Robie Carrobie thread. We all know how well that one went down.

1. What is there hope for? Me becoming a christian,perhaps?
Sure: why not?

3.So the bible is the truth and other religous books aren't, right? And why is that so exactly?
The reasons are many, but (somehow) I get the feeling you aren't in a place where you can hear them.

8.Calling me names? And judging me?
I'm certain you have me confused with someone else. Maybe even you. I'm thinking you're struggling with basic word definitions. What I am saying is the scenarios you suggest are at odds with the facts of the case, namely, when you say the Lord Jesus Christ was merely one of many lords (which, in and of itself creates a quagmire of confusion), this is in direct conflict with His statements about Himself--- in addition to being in conflict with what the rest of the Bible says about Him.

Is that judgment? Well, it's about as judgmental as you pointing an accusatory finger at me, telling me that I am judging you. Do you see the trouble your stance puts you into? In your opinion, which of the following sentences contains judgment:

A car goes speeding (any rate of travel in excess of 25 MPH) down the street in front of my house, I shake my fist at them and yell, "Too damn fast!"

The driver of the car looks at me disdainfully, displays the middle phalanges of his left hand and mouths the word 'vacuum' to me as he presses the gas harder.

A police officer pulls the offending driver over and issues a ticket, calling the driver to stand before a judge and explain his side of the incident.

The driver signs for the ticket, driving off and muttering how much "This blows," under his breath.

A judge hears about both sides of the issue prior to rendering a decision.

12.Sarcastic at the wrong times.
Well, why don't you just cue me next time for when you think my sarcasm should be inserted. God forbid that I should offend your delicate sensibilities with my oafishness.


Perhaps we will have to let the forum decide who is the winner of this one.
I don't think we need any deliberations on part of the peanut gallery. I concede you have already won, and won handsomely. After all, you brilliantly turned the conversation completely away from the real issue (the blasphemy you displayed toward God) and put the spotlight on me and my supposed shortcomings. Congratulations, winner!

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]1. What is there hope for? Me becoming a christian,perhaps?
Sure: why not?

3.So the bible is the truth and other religous books aren't, right? And why is that so exactly?
The reasons are many, but (somehow) I get the feeling you aren't in a place where you can hear them.

8.Calling me names? And judging me?
I'm certain you have nd put the spotlight on me and my supposed shortcomings. Congratulations, winner![/b]

Awww..there's the Freaky I've come to know and love.
Somehow that last post was more in keeping with the spirit of my posts. (imo-if that even matters to christians)

1. Why not become a Christian? Well its not the best religon I have come across. And I dont want to join any religons anyway . Sooooo....y'know...its not going to happen. Life is too short.

3.Is that what they call a strawman? Or just plain eluding the question?

8.In regard to Jesus' statements about himself they could be interpretted different ways. I have my interpretations and I like them. Makes him out to be a dude in my books. No Freaky, not a camels penis. But someone ... I'm searching for the word but cant find it. Lets just say my interpratation of Jesus is that he is cool.

Thanks for not wanting to offend my sensibilities with you oafishness. I'm sure you are being completely genuine when you excuse yourself for this. Why thank you.

Did I really COMPLETELY turn the conversation away from the real issue. I admit it. In a Christians eyes I am blasphemous towards the Christians God. Maybe only weak blasphemy. But blasphemy is blasphemy , and as such I guess must be stamped out at all costs. (I guess then you would have no one to talk about in your spare time and would have to take your attention back to your regurlar hobbies.)

So you finished? Did you maybe want to have a crack at why the bible is the only truth? I was actually quite interested to hear your answer. Why it is the truth at all is a debate in itself ,but the ONLY truth? Why thats just remarkeble. Who could've known? And to think all those millions of other religous folk have it completely wrong. Why are they not flocking to Christianity in this age of the internet as quicker communications in general? Huh? I heard there was a lack of interest in the church lately. Are we headed for dark times perhaps?

Originally posted by karoly aczel
Awww..there's the Freaky I've come to know and love.
Somehow that last post was more in keeping with the spirit of my posts. (imo-if that even matters to christians)

1. Why not become a Christian? Well its not the best religon I have come across. And I dont want to join any religons anyway . Sooooo....y'know...its not going to happen. Life is too sh ...[text shortened]... there was a lack of interest in the church lately. Are we headed for dark times perhaps?

1. Why not become a Christian? Well its not the best religon I have come across. And I dont want to join any religons anyway . Sooooo....y'know...its not going to happen. Life is too short.
For one, I never said it was a religion: that's your word. But let's not quibble about such distinctions. I wouldn't want anyone to join like they're joining some club, anyway. A person either chooses to walk that path--- or, at the very least, to accept the gift--- or not based upon their convictions of the issues involved.

I, for one, did not become a Christian because I thought it was cool. I accepted the gift and have been following the path because I hold it to be true. Nothing more, nothing less.

3.Is that what they call a strawman? Or just plain eluding the question?
Neither.

8.In regard to Jesus' statements about himself they could be interpretted different ways. I have my interpretations and I like them.
Do tell. Start here:

Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." -John 8:58

Lets just say my interpratation of Jesus is that he is cool.
You should get a hold of the Doobie Brothers and see if they're willing to do an update to their song. There must be, like, twelve words you could use to rhyme with 'cool.' Like, I dunno, 'tool,' 'fool' or what not.

In a Christians eyes I am blasphemous towards the Christians God. Maybe only weak blasphemy. But blasphemy is blasphemy , and as such I guess must be stamped out at all costs.
Well, at least you realize what your position in actuality really stands for. As far as 'stamping it out,' I leave that to the ages. I'm just calling a spade a spade, and you're finally agreeing that you did just that: blaspheme.

Did you maybe want to have a crack at why the bible is the only truth?
Start with that all-important term first, if you don't mind. Define truth. That way we know what merchandise we're dealing with.

And to think all those millions of other religous folk have it completely wrong.
Vox populi... Hey! We can't all be right, right?

Why are they not flocking to Christianity in this age of the internet as quicker communications in general? Huh?
Too much readily available porn? I'm sure the reasons are myriad.

I heard there was a lack of interest in the church lately. Are we headed for dark times perhaps?
The lack of interest is a direct reflection of the church's inability to relay any type of cogent message.
I don't think we're headed for dark times: I think we're in them.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]1. Why not become a Christian? Well its not the best religon I have come across. And I dont want to join any religons anyway . Sooooo....y'know...its not going to happen. Life is too short.
For one, I never said it was a religion: that's your word. But let's not quibble about such distinctions. I wouldn't want anyone to join like they're joining ...[text shortened]... e.
I don't think we're headed for dark times: I think we're in them.[/b]

I have too much of an ego to be concerned with having Jesus in my life. Anyway, I feel sorry for the guy. I mean all that bad that has been done in his name. Not to mention the ignorant and yes, the arrogant.That guy must have a lot on his plate.
As for truth all I can say is if I drop a brick on my foot it is the truth. You will swear black and blue that the brick hit my foot while I will indignitly maintain that my foot hit the brick. You cant write about the truth, only truisms, and even then there is great debate over it. I'm afraid the only truth is your own. That which you have experienced. Once it is put into words it becomes isolated from the whole and hence you have multiple viewpoints and the opportunity to misconstrue the facts.
Christianity is not a religon (?) Very good. This is a great way of reinforcing what I just said above in regards to the truth.
As we move out of the state of "karma" into the state of "grace" I would like to remind everyone that they all had a chance to listen and even HEAR the words of this generation.
This planet is headed for some disturbing times. Some will lose their grip. Some will hold on. Nothing is set in stone except that this WILL HAPPEN.

Now given this sense of urgency that I have just pointed out I will happily bow out of this one. Since you have succesfully evaded my questions I will know one of two things: Either you are a superior life form to me OR you are a struggling human being like myself and are willing to stick by your principles at all costs.

Cheers man,perhaps we will meet again in another form.