1. Joined
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    13 Sep '05 09:59
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    Please cite a few examples. I'm a sucker for an uplifting moral tale.

    William Burroughs was totally cured of heroin addiction by means of apomorphine. He went on to write (among other things) "Ghost of Chance", an intriguing tale of the Blood of Christ.
    I personally have many friends that were addicted to drugs and alcohol. They tried all types of rehab, but nothing helped. They were all from different backgrounds, but they all found a common cure: Jesus Christ. They have been totally set free from all types of addiction.
  2. Joined
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    13 Sep '05 10:07
    Originally posted by bbarr
    Many Muslims, Buddhists and Scientologists say the same. What does this prove about the veracity of your claims in particular?
    Many Muslims, Buddhists and Scientologists say the same.

    Who do they claim to have set them free?
  3. Donationbbarr
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    13 Sep '05 10:26
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    [b]Many Muslims, Buddhists and Scientologists say the same.

    Who do they claim to have set them free?[/b]
    That is irrelevant. Being "set free" from addiction or living poorly or whatever is not evidence for the truth of your faith in particular, because (1) many christians are not "set free", and (2) many non-christians are "set free". That is, being "set free" does not track christianity any more than it tracks other faiths.
  4. Joined
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    13 Sep '05 10:45
    Originally posted by bbarr
    That is irrelevant. Being "set free" from addiction or living poorly or whatever is not evidence for the truth of your faith in particular, because (1) many christians are not "set free", and (2) many non-christians are "set free". That is, being "set free" does not track christianity any more than it tracks other faiths.
    That is irrelevant. Being "set free" from addiction or living poorly or whatever is not evidence for the truth of your faith in particular, because (1) many christians are not "set free",

    I think it is very relevant, because:

    (1) Not all "christians" know Jesus Christ.
    (2) All "true christians" that have been set free from drug and porn addiction, have made the claim that they have been set free by Jesus Christ.

    2) many non-christians are "set free".

    Set free from what? Drug and porn addiction? Without any medical help?
    I'd love a few examples...

    That is, being "set free" does not track christianity any more than it tracks other faiths.

    That brings me back to the point of whom or what they claim to have set them free, and whether they have indeed been set free. I don't know of any other religion that would require a person to be set free from sin in order to qualify to enter into Heaven. If I am wrong, please help me out...
  5. Meddling with things
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    13 Sep '05 12:14
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    I would really encourage the skeptics to read this book. I regard this as evidence for His existance.

    A Skeptic's Search for God: Convincing Evidence for His Existence
    by Ralph O. Muncaster

    www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0736904522?v=glance
    Presumably this is evidence in the loosest sense of the word
  6. Joined
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    13 Sep '05 12:24
    Originally posted by aardvarkhome
    Presumably this is evidence in the loosest sense of the word
    You will presumably be more able to comment if you have read the book.
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    13 Sep '05 13:01
    Originally posted by LemonJello
    exactly what evidence does the book present for His existence? could you summarize it briefly, or is there just so much overwhelming evidence that i just have to read the book for myself? i tend to think you'll lean toward the latter.
    A former atheist and hardcore Bible skeptic, Ralph Muncaster spent 15 years conducting research to dispute the Bible. To Ralph, it seemed that the Bible could not possibly be consistent with such sciences as anthropology, molecular biology and physics. Armed with an engineering education and a critical, questioning mind, to his surprise the more he searched, the more evidence he found - evidence that supports the Bible's claims. In 1986, Ralph became aware of the prophetic accuracy of the Bible. He recognized that such precision is "statistically impossible". Investigating the scientific and historical documentation and its consistency with the Bible, he was startled by his findings: manuscripts written thousands of years ago contain information that could not possibly have been known at that time . . . without divine intervention.
  8. Standard memberBosse de Nage
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    13 Sep '05 13:11
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    Investigating the scientific and historical documentation and its consistency with the Bible, he was startled by his findings: manuscripts written thousands of years ago contain information that could not possibly have been known at that time . . . without divine intervention.
    Ah, now we're talking. What manuscripts? What information? One example will do for now...
  9. Standard memberUmbrageOfSnow
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    13 Sep '05 14:17
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    A former atheist and hardcore Bible skeptic, Ralph Muncaster spent 15 years conducting research to dispute the Bible. To Ralph, it seemed that the Bible could not possibly be consistent with such sciences as anthropology, molecular biology and physics. Armed with an engineering education and a critical, questioning mind, to his surprise the more he searche ...[text shortened]... ormation that could not possibly have been known at that time . . . without divine intervention.
    Nothing is "statisticaly imposiible", just extremely unlikely. Did he do a chi-squared test or any other real measure of statistical improbability? I plan to pick up this book next time I go to the library by the way, so don't yell at me to read it myself.
  10. Connecticut
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    13 Sep '05 14:25
    I read books on string theory during my "search" for Catholicism.

    /gots nuttin.
  11. Hmmm . . .
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    13 Sep '05 15:35
    Originally posted by dj2becker
    I personally have many friends that were addicted to drugs and alcohol. They tried all types of rehab, but nothing helped. They were all from different backgrounds, but they all found a common cure: Jesus Christ. They have been totally set free from all types of addiction.
    I personally have had alcoholic friends that stopped drinking through AA (and remained sober for 20+ years and still counting) that are not Christian and don't define their "higher power" in any more specific terms than that. Some of the finest people I know...
  12. Standard memberfrogstomp
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    13 Sep '05 18:07
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    Ah, now we're talking. What manuscripts? What information? One example will do for now...
    I'd love to see the Math lmao.
  13. Standard memberBosse de Nage
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    14 Sep '05 08:42
    Originally posted by frogstomp
    I'd love to see the Math lmao.
    I wouldn't understand the math. At this stage a couple of examples will do well enough.
  14. Joined
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    14 Sep '05 11:48
    Originally posted by UmbrageOfSnow
    Nothing is "statisticaly imposiible", just extremely unlikely. Did he do a chi-squared test or any other real measure of statistical improbability? I plan to pick up this book next time I go to the library by the way, so don't yell at me to read it myself.
    Nothing is "statisticaly imposiible", just extremely unlikely.

    If something is not "statistically possible" it means that it is so extremely unlikely that it becomes "statisticaly imposiible."

    e.g. The chances of you winning the National Lottery every year for 20 years in a row is so extremely unlikely that it becomes a "statistical impossibility".
  15. Donationkirksey957
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    14 Sep '05 12:29
    Originally posted by vistesd
    I personally have had alcoholic friends that stopped drinking through AA (and remained sober for 20+ years and still counting) that are not Christian and don't define their "higher power" in any more specific terms than that. Some of the finest people I know...
    It has been my experience that many in AA found that organized religion to be part of the problem. AA is a spiritual program. Who are we to dismiss it.
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