Originally posted by Jay Joos
Questions always questions....if you read your bible your answers lie within...im not going to start quoting this and that and get all heavy...who are we to question God.

I have a feeling you know the answers to your questions...

at least answer the first question.
so many people harp on "free-will" all time, and i'm just curious where you guys come up with this notion.

Originally posted by Big Mac
at least answer the first question.
so many people harp on "free-will" all time, and i'm just curious where you guys come up with this notion.

You really need to read a bible....

It all began in the Garden of Eden...

Originally posted by Jay Joos
You really need to read a bible....

It all began in the Garden of Eden...

but i have.
i just don't see it.
it's neither explicitly mentioned nor, to my satisfaction, implicitly mentioned.
i do, however, read much in the book about the sovereinty of god over the decisions of men.
i'm curious how you, unless you'd like to speak on behalf of all "free-willers," reconcile these seemingly conflicting ideas.

and as far as the garden goes, i guess i'm missing the part of god creating male and female with free will. are you assuming that's what the "image of god" is?

Originally posted by Big Mac
but i have.
i just don't see it.
it's neither explicitly mentioned nor, to my satisfaction, implicitly mentioned.
i do, however, read much in the book about the sovereinty of god over the decisions of men.
i'm curious how you, unless you'd like to speak on behalf of all "free-willers," reconcile these seemingly conflicting ideas.

and as far as the gar ...[text shortened]... ng male and female with free will. are you assuming that's what the "image of god" is?

God did not intend us to have free will....thats how i interpret it... when Adam bit into the apple thats when we became free willers...Typical of Satan always trying to ruin the big mans plan... i dont speak on behalf of anyone...i merely go where my heart tells me...(that is God..who i try to speak for but always seem to be misunderstood!!!)

Originally posted by Jay Joos
God did not intend us to have free will....thats how i interpret it... when Adam bit into the apple thats when we became free willers...Typical of Satan always trying to ruin the big mans plan... i dont speak on behalf of anyone...i merely go where my heart tells me...(that is God..who i try to speak for but always seem to be misunderstood!!!)

i don't wish to simply argue with you here, but...

how can something that an "omni-everything" god (as scotty calls him) intend not come to fruition?

did god know it was going to happen? if so, why would he deliberately set into motion things he did not intend?

Originally posted by Big Mac
i don't wish to simply argue with you here, but...

how can something that an "omni-everything" god (as scotty calls him) intend not come to fruition?

did god know it was going to happen? if so, why would he deliberately set into motion things he did not intend?

I dont want to argue with you also.... once again i say....who are we to question God? maybe he tested us and we failed...who knows !!!

Originally posted by Jay Joos
I dont want to argue with you also.... once again i say....who are we to question God? maybe he tested us and we failed...who knows !!!

i'm not encouraging you to question god.
i am encouraging you to question some of your premises; in particular those that are not derived from the bible, but simply from your feelings about the world and ascribing those to god.

Originally posted by Big Mac
i'm not encouraging you to question god.
i am encouraging you to question some of your premises; in particular those that are not derived from the bible, but simply from your feelings about the world and ascribing those to god.

My feelings are about HIS world... i believe the Bible and i believe my feelings...