Can somebody recommend a Bible for me?

Originally posted by Metamorphosis
Regarding critical Bible scholarship, the group often recognized as preeminent authorities on the historical analysis of Christianity is the "Westar Institute", which is a kind of think tank for some of the most rigorous Biblical scholars like Burton Mack, Dominic Crossan, Robert Funk, etc. (These are all highly credentialed professors, and most are ...[text shortened]... ally I think the Westar Institute (link above) offers the most balanced critique on the matter.

Doesn't reading all that mess up the Tao a bit for you?

Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
I visited my local bookstore to peruse the selection of annotated Bibles.

I saw several varieties, inlcuding those geared toward Catholics, teens, the simple-minded, and other niche groups. I noticed that there don't seem to be ...[text shortened]... w of a Bible whose annotations are primarily refutatory in nature?

If you want to understand Marx and Engels you don't ask SVW to interprete and annotate their works.
If you want to understand the Qu'ran you don't ask Billy Graham to interprete and annotate this book.
If you want to understand the Bible you don't ask a sceptic to interprete and annotate this collection of Books.

Unless of course you want to confirm and strenghten your existing opinions and prejudices in your ideological struggle against the religious right.

Originally posted by telerion
Notice also the Skeptics Annotated Quran and Skeptics Annotated Book of Mormon.

I can't stop laughing after reading the annotated Book of Mormon

"The plates ... I have given the name of Nephi; wherefore, they are called the plates of Nephi, after mine own name; and these plates also are called the plates of Nephi."

Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
I visited my local bookstore to peruse the selection of annotated Bibles.

I saw several varieties, inlcuding those geared toward Catholics, teens, the simple-minded, and other niche groups. I noticed that there don't seem to be any geared toward skeptics.

Does anybody know of a Bible whose annotations are primarily refutatory in nature?

I would sugest the "new" king james version, it carries the aquarian stamp of approval.

In addition to the Skeptics Annotated Bible I would suggest two subscriptions to supliment your journey. The Door magazine is an absolutely irreverent look at modern Christianity by people who are actually very devoted to their faith. On a more serious note, read The Christian Century. I think you would like both of these for different reasons.

I would recommend you to not read anything Kirk recommends.

Originally posted by ivanhoe

I would recommend you to not read anything Kirk recommends.

Thank you. I was waiting for your endorsement.

Originally posted by ivanhoe
If you want to understand Marx and Engels you don't ask SVW to interprete and annotate their works.
If you want to understand the Qu'ran you don't ask Billy Graham to interprete and annotate this book.
If you want to understand the Bible you don't ask a sceptic to interprete and annotate this collection of Books.

Unless of course you want to confir ...[text shortened]... r existing opinions and prejudices in your ideological struggle against the religious right.

I disagree with your analogy.

Both SVW and Graham approach their respective topics with a fundamental ignorance about
what they critique. There criticisms are often intercontradictory and misrepresentative.

Any given skeptic may be this way, but the collection cited isn't. It is a blow-by-blow
critique of a literal reading of the Bible (and all the problems associated with it).

Whereas it is often very simple to dismiss SVW's and Graham's commentaries with a
basic knowledge of their topics, I do not see the same ease refuting many of the points
made.

Perhaps, Ivanhoe, you could educate us by selecting two or three points from the skeptic
commentary and offer your own commentary as refutation. This would be enough to
make me approach the SAB with skepticism.

Nemesio

Originally posted by Metamorphosis
Regarding critical Bible scholarship, the group often recognized as preeminent authorities on the historical analysis of Christianity is the "Westar Institute", which is a kind of think tank for some of the most rigorous Biblical scholars like Burton Mack, Dominic Crossan, Robert Funk, etc. (These are all highly credentialed professors, and most are also Christians). Here's the link...

http://virtualreligion.net/forum/

These scholars have published several books providing a word-by-word analysis of the New Testamant, including a probability factor for the likelihood that Jesus actually said what was attributed to him. (As I recall, in the end they estimated that about 50% of all words attributed to him were never spoken by him).

When last I heard, they were referred to as the 'Jesus Seminar.' They published a book called
'The Five Gospels' which takes every single statement attributed to Jesus and rates it on the
likelihood of Jesus's having said it. While the rating is subjective, the commentary on each
statement is very illuminating.

The book can be purchased here:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/006063040X/qid=1115824862/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/103-2172994-5533431?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

For Biblical criticism from an established Christian priest, I'd recommend Episcopalian Bishop John Shelby Spong. His books are very interesting. He has basically declared all the miracles -- including the virgin birth and resurrection -- to be myths. His last book was titled "Why Christianity Must Change Or Die." Not surprsingly, he has received death threats over the years.

Well, he's written a few since that book. He wrote his interesting biography (which is an
insight into why he has his own particular perspective, if nothing else). And he published
(in 2002?) 'A New Christianity for a New World.' I don't recommend reading an awful lot
of his books, though, not because they aren't informative but because they are painfully
repetitious. He is constantly reviewing material from previous books, largely because he
cannot assume that his audience has read them. So, in any given book, you can assume
that about half of it will be review (and the manner in which he does this review is often
from a defensive posture, given the liberality of his theological perspective).

Another interesting one is the former Dominican priest Matthew Fox. For his criticisms of Roman Catholicism he was ordered into one year of silence by the then "Cardinal" Ratzinger, partly because Fox tried to have dialogue with Wiccans (Witches) and Native American spiritual teachers. He was eventually forced out of the priesthood, but not before publishing several excellent books.

I'm surprised you left out Hans Küng from this list of criticizers of the RCC. I don't know
Fox's works. Do you have a recommended list?

Originally posted by ivanhoe
If you want to understand Marx and Engels you don't ask SVW to interprete and annotate their works.
If you want to understand the Qu'ran you don't ask Billy Graham to interprete and annotate this book.
If you want to understand the Bible you don't ask a sceptic to interprete and annotate this collection of Books.

Unless of course you want to confir ...[text shortened]... r existing opinions and prejudices in your ideological struggle against the religious right.

What if you want to understand a cult? Do you just follow the leader?

Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
What if you want to understand a cult? Do you just follow the leader?

In case of understanding the Scriptures I would like to advise you to take a guide you can trust, a guide who will communicate the genuine and true understanding of the Scriptures, an orthodox Roman Catholic priest who is willing to teach you the interpretations of the Scriptures according to the teachings of the Magisterium of the Roman Catholic Church.
You will never be able to correctly understand and interprete the Scriptures reading and studying them on your own. The following is what the Scriptures themselves tell us about this.


The King James Bible, Acts, chapter 8.


27": And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship,

"28": Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet.

"29": Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.

"30": And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?

"31": And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

"32": The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:

"33": In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.

"34": And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?

"35": Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.


The King James Bible, Acts, chapter 8.

Originally posted by ivanhoe
In case of understanding the Scriptures I would like to advise you to take a guide you can trust, a guide who will communicate the genuine and true understanding of the Scriptures, an orthodox Roman Catholic priest who is willing to teach y ...[text shortened]... to the teachings of the Magisterium of the Roman Catholic Church.

Why should we trust a person who believes that the Magesterium's proclamations are infallible
or that the Bible is the authoritative Word of God?

Why not Billy Graham, who has a incredible command of Scripture?

And why should we turn to Christianity?

Why shouldn't we trust, say, a Shaman of a Native-American tribe, trained in ancient
traditions of holistic attentiveness to the Great Spirit?

Or, why shouldn't we trust a Rabbi of an ultra-Orthodox Hassidic tradition?

What about a wizened Iman in the nearby Mosque?

Or the Dali Lama?

Nemesio

Originally posted by ivanhoe


In case of understanding the Scriptures I would like to advise you to take a guide you can trust, a guide who will communicate the genuine and true understanding of the Scriptures

...

The King James Bible, Acts, chapter 8.

And why is a good Roman Catholic quoting from the faulty (Protestant) King James
Bible, anyway?

Nemesio

Ivanhoe, what are your feelings about the term "priesthood of the believer"?

Originally posted by Nemesio
And why is a good Roman Catholic quoting from the faulty (Protestant) King James
Bible, anyway?

Nemesio

.... lol ........ 😀