Spirituality
27 Dec 07
27 Dec 07
Here's something that i've never quite understood about devil worship: what's the incentive? God bribes people with the prospect of eternity in heaven, which is supposed to be a pleasant place. Whats in it for devil worshippers - an eternity in hell? that's supposed to be something to avoid. Or are all the benefits earthly benefits - in which case, it seems stupid because no finite life on earth, no matter how good, could outweigh an eternity in hell. I take it though that these people aren't (all) stupid. So, what's the deal?
27 Dec 07
Originally posted by Iron MonkeyFrom Wikipedia:
Here's something that i've never quite understood about devil worship: what's the incentive? God bribes people with the prospect of eternity in heaven, which is supposed to be a pleasant place. Whats in it for devil worshippers - an eternity in hell? that's supposed to be something to avoid. Or are all the benefits earthly benefits - in which case, it se ...[text shortened]... nity in hell. I take it though that these people aren't (all) stupid. So, what's the deal?
LaVeyan Satanism is a religion founded in 1966 by Anton LaVey. Its teachings are based on individualism, social Darwinism, self-indulgence, and "eye for an eye" morality, with influence from Friedrich Nietzsche and Ayn Rand, while its rituals and magic draw heavily from occultists such as Aleister Crowley. Borrowing Crowley's terminology, its adherents define Satanism as a "Left-Hand Path" religion, rejecting traditional "Right-Hand Path" religions such as Christianity for their perceived denial of life and emphasis on guilt and abstinence. Unlike Theistic Satanism, which is rejected by the Church of Satan as Christian heresy rather than Satanism, it does not literally worship Satan, but rather uses "Satan" as a symbol for people's natural inner desires.[1]
Anton LaVey established Satanism's first and largest religious organization, the Church of Satan, in 1966, and codified Satanic beliefs and practices in the Satanic Bible in 1969. According to the Church of Satan, there are many Satanists around the world, including both members and non-members. It rejects the legitimacy of any other organizations of Satanists, dubbing them reverse-Christians and pseudo-Satanists. Although exact numbers have never been released, it has been estimated that the number of adherents is in the tens of thousands.
27 Dec 07
1 edit
Originally posted by Iron MonkeyI have observed that some tyes of people get a rush out the prospect of revolting against God. It is the ultimate ego trip.
Here's something that i've never quite understood about devil worship: what's the incentive? God bribes people with the prospect of eternity in heaven, which is supposed to be a pleasant place. Whats in it for devil worshippers - an eternity in hell? that's supposed to be something to avoid. Or are all the benefits earthly benefits - in which case, it se ...[text shortened]... nity in hell. I take it though that these people aren't (all) stupid. So, what's the deal?
They think "Wow. Think of it. I am standing against God." There is some kind of perverse gratification in this.
Incidently, heaven is not the eternal destiny of the saved. And I don't see God bribing anyone to do anything.
I don't see your parents "bribing" you to be born. Nor do I see God bribing anyone to be born again. Presumably we are the ones who want life and want it abundantly.
27 Dec 07
2 edits
Originally posted by rwingettThe one possibly good thing Aton LaVay did was tell the truth to all the practicers of magic, white magic, so-called "good" magic, "good" witches, sorcerers, and all who dabble in the occult, in essence - LaVay said:
From Wikipedia:
LaVeyan Satanism is a religion founded in 1966 by Anton LaVey. Its teachings are based on individualism, social Darwinism, self-indulgence, and "eye for an eye" morality, with influence from Friedrich Nietzsche and Ayn Rand, while its rituals and magic draw heavily from occultists such as Aleister Crowley. Borrowing Crowley's terminolo , it has been estimated that the number of adherents is in the tens of thousands.
"Hey you guys, You're all getting your powers from the same source - Satan. Don't kid yourselves." (paraphrased)
In that aspect he did a service to the Christian church. They wouldn't believe it if Christians told them that.
27 Dec 07
3 edits
Originally posted by Iron MonkeyOne moment of fellowship with Jesus is worth more than 50 years of the fleeting and decptive enjoyment of sin.
yeah, but as i already said, to take, say, 50 or 60 years of earthly pleasure in exchange for an eternity in hell would be stupid.
What is more valuable than the love of Jesus?
What is more precious than the love of Jesus?
What in the entire univere can one compare to the value of Jesus Christ?
I have found that nothing the is more precious than knowing Christ.
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27 Dec 07
Originally posted by Iron MonkeyYou have to bear in mind that the folks that call themselves Satanists really don't believe that they are going to spend eternity in hell.
yeah, but as i already said, to take, say, 50 or 60 years of earthly pleasure in exchange for an eternity in hell would be stupid.
27 Dec 07
Originally posted by jaywillyou know that bit in the bible when JC is on the cross and he says 'father, why have you abandoned me'? i think that's the moment he stared into the abyss and realised that, after all, there is nothing out there, nothing after death. it was a cry of fear and despair, and disappointment.
One [b]moment of fellowship with Jesus is worth more than 50 years of the fleeting and decptive enjoyment of sin.
What is more valuable than the love of Jesus?
What is more precious than the love of Jesus?
What in the entire univere can one compare to the value of Jesus Christ?
I have found that nothing the is more precious than knowing Christ.[/b]
27 Dec 07
Originally posted by Iron MonkeyReally Iron Monkey?? Is that what you think ?
you know that bit in the bible when JC is on the cross and he says 'father, why have you abandoned me'? i think that's the moment he stared into the abyss and realised that, after all, there is nothing out there, nothing after death. it was a cry of fear and despair, and disappointment.
You see I have never had the experience of being separated from the Father after an eternity of oneness with Him in eternal love. So I cannot think what it must have been like.
But some people say that at that moment He experienced the equivalance of eternal separation from God for all of mankind.
He cried that for you so that you would never have to cry that. Such love He had for you.
27 Dec 07
Originally posted by jaywillif it went down as told in the bible and he said that at that moment, then that's how i would interpret it, yes - but i interpret it that way partly because i am not a believer. naturally, devout believers will interpret it differently, as you have.
Really Iron Monkey?? Is that what you think ?
You see I have never had the experience of being separated from the Father after an eternity of oneness with Him in eternal love. So I cannot think what it must have been like.
But some people say that at that moment He experienced the equivalance of eternal separation from God for all of mankind.
He cried that for you so that you would never have to cry that. Such love He had for you.
but ask yourself: why do i believe all this? all you have is an ancient book (and there are many ancient books with competing accounts of the truth, so what's special about this one), and a kind of inner 'gut feeling'. that's not grounds for rational belief imho, and that's why i don't believe. a gut feeling is not evidence of anything.