Originally posted by Iron Monkey Here's something that i've never quite understood about devil worship: what's the incentive? God bribes people with the prospect of eternity in heaven, which is supposed to be a pleasant place. Whats in it for devil worshippers - an eternity in hell? that's supposed to be something to avoid. Or are all the benefits earthly benefits - in which case, it se ...[text shortened]... nity in hell. I take it though that these people aren't (all) stupid. So, what's the deal?
Devil worshippers are often atheists protesting Christianity. I doubt many of them believe in the Christian mythos. Take a look at the "Satanist" entry in Wikipedia. You'll notice not all Satanists actually worship the devil.
Some might believe they'll become powerful figures in Hell - "better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven" kind of thing. These I suppose believe that Hell isn't really that unpleasant if you're in the right place and have the right people on your side.
Sometimes they worship pagan gods who they believe have been demonized unfairly by Christianity.
Thus, the theme seems to be - they disagree with Christians about How Things Work in the supernatural realm (whatever that is).
Originally posted by AThousandYoung Devil worshippers are often atheists protesting Christianity. I doubt many of them believe in the Christian mythos. Take a look at the "Satanist" entry in Wikipedia. You'll notice not all Satanists actually worship the devil.
Some might believe they'll become powerful figures in Hell - "better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven" kind of thing. s they worship pagan gods who they believe have been demonized unfairly by Christianity.
yeah, i read LaVey's Satanic Bible (it was actually given to me by an RHPer😲 ) a while back - he comes across as sort of an anti-high anglican, in that the metaphysical belief in the devil/hell didn't seem important. i've seen it claimed that 'real' satanists hold LaVey and his church in contempt. but claiming to be a satanist and not to believe in satan makes as much sense to me as christians who don't believe christ was the son of god. i would have thought a conceptual truth is involved in each case.
Originally posted by Iron Monkey that would certainly be an interesting view - that god and the devil exist, but there is no afterlife.
Believe it or not I don't think Satanists (at least Church of Satan members) actually believe in the existence of god and the devil. At least not in the Christian sense. I think the philosophy is somewhere along the lines of: each man is his own god.
Originally posted by Iron Monkey yeah, i read LaVey's Satanic Bible (it was actually given to me by an RHPer😲 ) a while back - he comes across as sort of an anti-high anglican, in that the metaphysical belief in the devil/hell didn't seem important. i've seen it claimed that 'real' satanists hold LaVey and his church in contempt. but claiming to be a satanist and not to believe in sata ...[text shortened]... rist was the son of god. i would have thought a conceptual truth is involved in each case.
There are quite a lot of "Christians" who don't believe in God. The posers in my immediate family, for instance. They're "Catholic" because we're of Irish-Mexican ancestry, and they want to be part of the family community.
Originally posted by AThousandYoung Some might believe they'll become powerful figures in Hell - "better to rule in Hell than serve in Heaven" kind of thing. These I suppose believe that Hell isn't really that unpleasant if you're in the right place and have the right people on your side.
Thus, the theme seems to be - they disagree with Christians about How Things Work in the supernatural realm (whatever that is).
that would at least make adopting satanism rational i guess - but who would trust the devil to keep his word?
Originally posted by bbarr If God is not bound by any moral standard independent of His will, then why trust Him to keep His word?
i think you could trust him based on his past record of (apparent, at least) adherence to his word, which is one way we generally build up trust of others. as far as i know, there isn't a single case on record of god having gone back on his word in the past several thousand years, whereas the devil is known as the 'father of lies'. also, if god is omnipotent, he probably lacks motive to deceive us (unless he finds some intrinsic value in lying, but we don't have any reason to believe this to be so). and, if he really is perfectly good, he might be incapable of lying.
Originally posted by Iron Monkey i think you could trust him based on his past record of (apparent, at least) adherence to his word, which is one way we generally build up trust of others. as far as i know, there isn't a single case on record of god having gone back on his word in the past several thousand years, whereas the devil is known as the 'father of lies'. also, if god is omnipo believe this to be so). and, if he really is perfectly good, he might be incapable of lying.
Isaiah 43:10 I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
Exodus 12:12 And against all the gods of Egypt I will execute judgment.
Matthew 5:18-19
Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or tittle shall nowise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven.
Galatians 3:13
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law.
Well, there goes his record of adherence to his word.
Originally posted by Ullr You have to bear in mind that the folks that call themselves Satanists really don't believe that they are going to spend eternity in hell.
1. Satanists do not believe in Hell. Hell was invented by Christians to frighten nonbelievers into converting.
2. Satanists do not worship any deities. It is about the accumulation of personal power.
3. Please stop guessing as to what others believe. I have read the Satanic Bible and other books on the subject by Anton LaVey.
Originally posted by caissad4 1. Satanists do not believe in Hell. Hell was invented by Christians to frighten nonbelievers into converting.
2. Satanists do not worship any deities. It is about the accumulation of personal power.
3. Please stop guessing as to what others believe. I have read the Satanic Bible and other books on the subject by Anton LaVey.
LaVey and his followers have been mentioned several times in these thread - but they're kind of California New Age satanists are they not? I don't think they are representative of Satanists in general, though they are the ones that have received mos publicity over the past few devades. I am sure there are many Satanists who worship Satan, just as many Christians worship Jehovah, Muslims Allah and Hindus any number of deities (33,000,000 i think).
Originally posted by Iron Monkey LaVey and his followers have been mentioned several times in these thread - but they're kind of California New Age satanists are they not? I don't think they are representative of Satanists in general, though they are the ones that have received mos publicity over the past few devades. I am sure there are many Satanists who worship Satan, just as many Ch ...[text shortened]... istians worship Jehovah, Muslims Allah and Hindus any number of deities (33,000,000 i think).
I have known many Satanists over the years and for a Satanist to actually worship Satan is laughable. There are probably as many Satan worshipers as Christians who worship saints. Lavey was one of the first to codify Satanism.
Originally posted by caissad4 I have known many Satanists over the years and for a Satanist to actually worship Satan is laughable. There are probably as many Satan worshipers as Christians who worship saints. Lavey was one of the first to codify Satanism.
aleister crowley and his ilk apparently believed in the devil.
Originally posted by Iron Monkey yeah, but as i already said, to take, say, 50 or 60 years of earthly pleasure in exchange for an eternity in hell would be stupid.
He does not offer 50 or 60 years, it is more like just this one time, or
put off till tomorrow to get right with God.
Kelly
Originally posted by Iron Monkey aleister crowley and his ilk apparently believed in the devil.
Obviously you know very little about Aleister Crowley and his work. For starters he was not a Satanist or devil worshipper as some would like to believe.
27 Dec '07 17:024 edits
Devil worship
Back to Top