1. Unknown Territories
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    S. Some things God decreed to do Himself. These are the “immediate” things, in contrast to “mediate” things which He decreed that some other agency, such as the free will of man, would perform. For example, creation is “immediate.” There had to be a place for God’s creatures to live, so He created space. Space is incomprehensibly vast, mind-boggling in size. The basic unit of measure for space, the light year is used in increments of billions to describe what can be seen of the universe. God created space in a split second so that angels and man might have somewhere to live. The angels inhabit all of space, whereas we live in a very small part of it to resolve the angelic conflict. On this planet the angelic conflict is being resolved.

    God decreed that He would “immediately” create time. He set the earth on its rotation and orbit to give us our standard for measuring time. Besides space and time, salvation was also decreed to be provided by God Himself. Likewise, control of history by Jesus Christ is “immediate”--- He often takes a direct hand in a matter rather than relegating everything to secondary causes.

    T. God accomplishes some things, however, through the action of secondary causes acting under the law of necessity. Thus, the decree includes both primary and secondary causes.

    U. Other things God has decreed to promote or permit free agents to do in the exercise of their own free will and self-determination. On one hand, man’s own volition is responsible for sin, human good, and evil from the sin nature. On the other hand, man is free to believe in Christ through non-meritorious positive volition resulting in eternal salvation.

    V. One category of events is rendered by the decree of God to be just as certainly future as any other category. All events are equally certain to occur whether caused directly by the sovereignty of God or caused by the free will of man. Primary, secondary, or tertiary, every cause for every event is equally in the decree and will occur. Therefore, the sovereignty of God and the free will of man coexist in human history as an extension of the angelic conflict.
  2. Standard memberAThousandYoung
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    19 Mar '06 08:36
    Originally posted by FreakyKBH
    [b]This means that there is one thing that God does not know that I do.
    The greater always encompasses (and surpasses) the lesser. While the lesser may be able to approximate by imagination the qualities of the greater, the greater has no such limitation.
    Hunger may imagine and desire satiation, but can only experience its lack. Satiation knows bot ...[text shortened]... d: He created it in the first place, and therefore knew before physically experiencing the same.[/b]
    Satiation doesn't know hunger. Why do you think it does?
  3. Unknown Territories
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    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    Satiation doesn't know hunger. Why do you think it does?
    How did it become satiated?
  4. Unknown Territories
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    IV. Will of God and the Divine Decree

    A. There is one all-inclusive will or purpose of God concerning all that ever was or will be from the beginning of human history until its termination on the last day of the Millennium. God has known every thought, decision, and action that has ever occurred or will occur; all these things come into being through the divine decree. In the computer analogy, many things are printed out by the computer of the divine decree, but they were all in the computer.

    This is not referring to God’s will in the sense of divine guidance for the believer’s life. “Will of God” means His sovereign decision as to what would come into existence, or the divine decree.

    B. This will and purpose of God originated within Himself long before any creature of any kind existed. His will is always consistent with His perfect essence.

    C. The will and purpose of God--- the divine decree--- was objectively designed for His own glory, pleasure, and satisfaction.

    D. All creatures have been placed in space and time; all events related to space and time were instantaneously and simultaneously decreed. The fact that all events were decreed results in divine action. Of course, the divine action which is most interesting to humans is His work of grace--- the policy of His love and integrity in blessing believers. But there are many other categories of divine action; they fall under two classifications.
    1. Divine actions within the Godhead are immanent, intrinsic, and subjective.
    2. Divine actions related to creation are transient, extrinsic, and objective.

    E. God did not decree Himself to be. God existed prior to and outside of the decree, so that the decree does not act upon God; He acts upon the decree.

    F. God’s decree is efficacious--- having the power to produce the intended effect: it determines all that ever was or will be. The decree includes God’s directive will, permissive will, and overruling will. These three categories of divine will describe the manner in which God’s sovereignty controls history; they are subcategories of divine action as related to His creation. In particular, these three categories show how divine sovereignty deals with human volition. The will of God (as to what would exist, i.e., the divine decree) calls for God’s will (His attribute of sovereignty) to function toward us in certain ways:
    1. Directly stating what He desires of us;
    2. Permissively allowing us to go our own way;
    3. Overruling our decisions--- not letting them have their intended results--- in order to protect us and the rest of mankind from our own negative volition and to preserve and perpetuate His own marvelous plan.
  5. Unknown Territories
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    G. All things depend on God's will (the decree) and nothing is certain apart from God's will.

    H. God's decree originates from His own omniscience, and in eternity past the decree separated fact from fiction.

    I. We must make clear the distinction between God's omniscience and His foreknowledge.

    J. God's decree does not originate from His foreknowledge.

    K. God's foreknowledge makes nothing certain; it merely perceives what the decree has made certain. Prophecy never determines history.

    L. Nothing can be foreknown until it is first decreed.

    M. Foreknowledge is God's cognizance of what He has decreed regarding believers. In logical order: ominscience programs the computer of the divine decree, and the computer prints out various categories of information for foreknowledge to read.

    N. We must also distinguish between the decree of God and the desires of God. The decree merely establishes the facts of history; many things are included which God does not desire. They are in the decree because the ominscience of God knew that, given free will, His creatures would reject the divine design. All sins are acts of volition, and although God never approves of sin, He put them in the decree because He knew we would commit them. The decree deals with reality, with certainty, with what actually happens. Just because God decrees a particular event to take place does not mean He approves of it.

    O. Sin, human good, and evil are not the desire of God, but they are in the decree because people do these things from their own volition.
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  7. Hmmm . . .
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    25 Mar '06 07:142 edits
    Question Freaky:

    On a quick perusal, this seems to be a detailed presentation of strict Calvinism, identical to Colleti's "Christian wordlview." The combination of omniscience, foreknowledge and decree (especially in terms of the elect and the unelect) seems to amount to Calvinist double predestination.

    If I can freely choose to become one of the elect, then such choice was not decreed. I see no fundamental difference if you say that my "free choice" was itself decreed. The outcome is still predetermined by decree.

    EDIT: Those didn't come out as questions, but are intended as such.

    EDIT 2: I just did some re-reading, and it seems you are not talking about double-predestination, but only predestination for the elect (ala Augustine?); and that omnisicience (as opposed to foreknowledge) is knowledge of possibilities in such a way that the non-elect could freely choose the path of salvation or not. Is that correct?
  8. R
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    25 Mar '06 07:49
    Originally posted by FreakyKBH
    [b]G. All things depend on God's will (the decree) and nothing is certain apart from God's will.

    H. God's decree originates from His own omniscience, and in eternity past the decree separated fact from fiction.

    I. We must make clear the distinction between God's omniscience and His foreknowledge.

    J. God's decree does n ...[text shortened]... f God, but they are in the decree because people do these things from their own volition.[/b]
    I am confused. How can omniscience be distinct or not entail forknowledge (if that is how I am supposed to take it)?
  9. Unknown Territories
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    25 Mar '06 12:27
    Originally posted by vistesd
    Question Freaky:

    On a quick perusal, this seems to be a detailed presentation of strict Calvinism, identical to Colleti's "Christian wordlview." The combination of omniscience, foreknowledge and decree (especially in terms of the elect and the unelect) seems to amount to Calvinist double predestination.

    If I can freely choose to become one of the elec ...[text shortened]... way that the non-elect could freely choose the path of salvation or not. Is that correct?
    Yes. As stated, the decree is simply (ha!) the purpose of God. While we think in terms of logical order (with respect to both time and importance), the decree is one comprehensive thought which simultaneously considers all things at once.

    The entire human history; the entire angelic history; all of creation; including all possibilities; these are bound up and known by God as one unit of thought. In a word, integrity.
  10. Unknown Territories
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    Originally posted by Conrau K
    I am confused. How can omniscience be distinct or not entail forknowledge (if that is how I am supposed to take it)?
    Foreknowledge is within God's omniscience. While one refers to a specified field of God's knowledge, the latter refers to God's overall knowledge. The former is dependent upon the latter, and is informed thusly.
  11. Unknown Territories
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    Originally posted by vistesd
    Question Freaky:

    On a quick perusal, this seems to be a detailed presentation of strict Calvinism, identical to Colleti's "Christian wordlview." The combination of omniscience, foreknowledge and decree (especially in terms of the elect and the unelect) seems to amount to Calvinist double predestination.

    If I can freely choose to become one of the elec ...[text shortened]... way that the non-elect could freely choose the path of salvation or not. Is that correct?
    Your post got me to thinking about hyper-Calvinsm, or supralapsarianism. I found a good definition which can be quickly outlined thusly:

    a. The decree to elect some to be saved and to reprobate all others. This heretical position is double predestination, and denies the coexistence of the sovereignty of God and the free will of man.

    b. The decree to provide salvation for the elect. This is the basis for limited atonement and therefore a false position.

    c. The decree to create man, both elect and nonelect.

    d. The decree to permit the Fall.

    e. The decree to save the elect.

    There are, as you are aware, other flavors of Calvinism, including:
    Infralapsarianism
    Sublapsarianism
    And then,
    Arminian lapsarianism

    All of these forms are, in one manner or more, off the mark. Biblical lapsarianism is one that follows the biblical description of God's omniscience.

    1. God decreed the creation of all mankind with a free will in the status of perfection to resolve the prehistoric angelic conflict and to bring many sons into glory.

    2. God decreed to permit the fall of mankind through the function of man's own self-determination, his own volition as the extension of the angelic conflict into human history.

    3. God decreed to provide eternal salvation for all mankind under the doctrine of unlimited atonement.

    4. God decreed to leave the reprobate--- those who remain in spiritual death because they reject Christ as Savior--- in their just condemnation.

    5. God decreed simultaneously in eternity past both election and predestination for believers only.

    6. God decreed to apply salvation to everyone who believes in Christ. Hence, the decree to save the elect through faith alone in Jesus Christ alone.
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    P. God desires His perfect will, but angels and men use their God-given freedom to violate the desires of God. The very fact that sin and evil are in the decree is proof that our volition is truly free. The decree is the all-inclusive will of God; it contains all the facts of history--- both the decisions which please God and those which displease Him.

    Q. God does not desire to cast His creatures into the lake of fire, but it is decreed as certain for all men who reject Christ as Savior. His desire is for all unbelievers to come to a change of mind toward Christ. For those with negative volition at God-consciousness or a Gospel-hearing, the lake of fire is decreed and becomes a computer printout called retribution.

    R. God does not desire to discipline believers, but it is decreed as certain for all believers in reversionism or carnality. God desires to express His perfect justice toward you; if you do not permit His justice to bless you, His justice will not hesitate to discipline you. We were created as free agents responsible for our own decisions. Either we adjust to the justice of God or the justuce of God will adjust to us.

    S. We must distinguish the decre of God in eternity past from the actions of God in time. The action of God in time is the execution of the decree.

    T. The execution is not the decree but logically follows the decree.

    U. Distinction must also be made between God's decree and God's laws.

    V. The laws of divine establishment regulate human conduct; they are set up for human volition to obey. By protecting and perpetuating the human race, these laws give each of us a chance to be evangelized and, after believing in Christ, we have the opportunity to grow spiritually without interference or coercion. The laws of establishment can be broken by our volition, but the decree cannot.

    W. We cannot violate the decree because any decision we make was known in eternity past and was included in the decree.

    X. The decree is the all-comprehensive will of God and is only partially revealed in Scripture; the laws of God regulate man's conduct in time and space and are completely revealed.
  13. Unknown Territories
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    V. The Blessing of Man and the Divine Decree

    A.
    The ominscience of God in taking cognizance of the fall of man graciously provided a plan for belssing man based on the imputations from divine justice.

    B. This plan involves the omniscience of God feeding into the computer of the divine decree seven imputations which provide maximum blessing for makind in time and eternity.
    1. The imputation of human life at birth.
    2. The imputation of Adam's original sin at birth.
    3. The imputation of all personal sins to Christ on the cross.
    4. The imputation of divine righteousness at the moment of salvation.
    5. The imputation of eternal life at the moment of salvation.
    6. The imputation of blessings in time at spiritual maturity.
    7. The imputation of blessings and rewards at the judegment seat of Christ.

    C. The decree of God contains the historical reality regarding every human being's level of attainment in this grace plan. Freedom means that some attain all these imputations while others do not. Freedom ensures inequality. The road to equality is the road to slavery.

    D. Nonmeritorious human volition can fall short of any potential in God's plan.

    E. The extent to which each individual advances in this plan was known to God in eternity past. This was fed into the computer. God knew that some would remain unbelievers, that others would believe but remain spiritually immature, that a few would advance to maturity. Those who reach maturity receive blessings in time and even greater blessings in eternity; they glorify God and bring Him pleasure.

    F. In too many cases, the potential exceeds the reality. The potential is totally known to God's omniscience; only the reality is in the decree.

    G. The believver's attainment of divine blessings through imputation is the means God has chosen to glorify Himself and to give Himself pleasure.

    H. The glory of God is related to the believer's advance to maturity and the resultant imputation of divine blessings.
  14. Unknown Territories
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    VI. The Glory of God and the Divine Decree

    A.
    The decree unites in one all-inclusive and final objective the glory of God.

    B. Since the members of the Godhead were alone before all creation, the decree of God concerned no one but the Trinity. The decree was designed to glorify the members of the Godhead who were there when the decree was made, not to glorify us who were not there. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit had infinite glory in eternity past and will have it in eternity future. Whatever they do in the interim--- from the creation of the universe to the conclusion of history--- must bring them ultimate glory. Generally, the decree relates to the glory of the Lord Jesus Christ because He is the manifest person of the Trinity. When history terminates, God's glory will be as perfect as it was before time began. Our failures do not compromise the glory of God. His glory does not depend on us; we depend upon His glory.

    Grace is born of the glory of God. Grace means that God does all the work which adds up to our blessing. Whether in time or eternity, divine blessing is through grace. The only things related to us that can glorify God are what God Himself accomplishes, such as imputing His righteousness or providing doctrine. That is why He despises our self-righteousness and hypocrisy. He has no use for our legalism and humand good, and He severely disciplines the legalist. When we begin to glorify ourselves, our accomplishments, our knowledge, or our expereinces, we are deluding ourselves and setting ourselves up for divine discipline.

    Any time we are blessed by God, we can count on one thing: we did not earn or deserve it. Blessing is God's doing, exhibiting His glory, and we do not have to keep looking over our shoulder expecting to lose it. Once we understand His glory, we will certainly not want to intrude on it; we will want to go along with it. Therein lies the blessing.

    C. Being infinite, God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit are worthy of all glory.

    D. God's glory is what He is. Here we have the entire doctrine of divine essence. Receiving glory is nothing new to the Trinity. All three Persons have always had it and always will. In eternity past, They did not need to add anything to what They already had; God has never suffered any kind of deficiency. They had infinite pleasure in each other; They were perfectly satisfied and perfectly happy. As part of that pleasure They simply decided to create a universe and put free creatures in it--- first angels, then mankind. The members of the Trinity knew what such creatures would do, and based on that, They made many further decisions.
  15. Unknown Territories
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    E. Since He is the origin and subject (not the object) of the decree, God will inevitably be glorified by every thought, every decision, every action in human history. The good and the bad are included; sin, evil, everything will add up to the glorification of God. Even the "wrath of man shall praise Him." In other words, the plan of God began with glory and will end with glory; the plan of God is never hindered; it never stops; it moves on with you or without you, no matter what you do. If you remain an unbeliever, you will go to hell, and God's glory will remain uncompromised and untarnished. If you believe in Christ, you will go to heaven, again consistent with the glory of God. Both in time and in eternity God's character is vindicated in everything that occurs.

    F. God is glorified not only in what He is but also in what He has decreed.

    G. To the finite mind, the decrees are many, but to God, they are all one plan embracing both cause and effect, means and end.

    H. The decree includes every detail in the experience of every creature, including such minute aspects as the number of hairs on your head. Even in a national disaster, when many mature believers will be isolated and alone, they can still do their jobs and live their lives as unto the Lord, knowing that God has not forgotten them.

    I. The decree of God is the sovereign purpose of God which is efficaciously accomplished by God alone, apart from all creature ability, mentality, talent, counsel, or cooperation.

    J. God is glorified and pleased in the momentum and advance of believers within His plan.

    K. The ominscience of God knew in eternity past what thoughts, motivations, decisions, and actions would carry one believer to maturity and another into reversionism. God has prepared the most phenomenal blessings and rewards for the mature believer--- approved by the righteousness of God and imputed by the justice of God. He has also prepared severe discipline for the reversionist believer to bring him back into fellowship with Him.

    L. While omniscience knew the actual and potential, only the actual was fed into the computer of the divine decree. Anything decreed by God will inevitably glorify God; it could not work out any other way.

    M. The divine decree is executed through imputation from the justice of God.

    N. The seven imputations--- five real and two judicial--- add up to the glory of God.
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