1. Hmmm . . .
    Joined
    19 Jan '04
    Moves
    22131
    18 Aug '15 13:001 edit
    Originally posted by chaney3
    Vistesd, you are mistaken. All you need to do is read the 12 steps of AA, to clearly see that God MUST be involved with recovery.

    The 'higher power' issue is just a front.....a quaint lie. I have shared that my friend in AA chose the OCEAN as a higher power, and failed. The higher power issue falls badly when introduced to the 12 steps of AA.

    Please ...[text shortened]... do battle with you. But, on this front, I am correct. God is most required in one's recovery.
    This is not an issue on which I will "do battle" with anyone, nor did I intend to set myself as your "opponent". Perhaps I should not have posted, but you are making public claims here that no one who has much experience in the program would make. There are many personal views in AA, and you have just implied that a whole lot of longtime sober AA members are either (quaint) liars or deluded about the program that has kept them sober. AA is more than reading the BB and the wording of the steps--and deciding what they must mean to everyone.

    I suggest that you quit using the program to generate debate here.

    At least tell your group and your sponsor what you are doing!

    It is not something that I will engage in public debate on.



    Be well.
  2. R
    Standard memberRemoved
    Joined
    03 Jan '13
    Moves
    13080
    18 Aug '15 14:38
    Derek Prince's series of 5 videos on the subject is prayer and petition are certainly worthwhile to hear. It is practical and pragmatic and will equip you with faith and furnish you with skill to pray well.

    Thy Kingdom Come (1 of 5)

    YouTube&list=PLABDC21F765DDD03E

    YouTube&list=PLABDC21F765DDD03E&index=2

    YouTube&list=PLABDC21F765DDD03E&index=2

    YouTube&index=4&list=PLAB

    YouTube&index=4&list=PLABDC21F765DDD03E
  3. Joined
    02 Jan '06
    Moves
    12857
    18 Aug '15 16:00
    Originally posted by chaney3
    I have previously admitted that I was involved with Alcoholics Anonymous.

    AA's doctrine (not mine), says that ONLY God can help an alcoholic, and that if the alcoholic just asks God for help, then God will help them.

    Really?

    Does anyone believe that God answers prayers? And, that God will involve Himself in a persons life upon request? I do not.
    ...[text shortened]... fail.

    Basically, does anyone believe without a doubt, that God actually answers our prayers?
    So you are a Catholic but don't believe God answers prayer?

    What then is your position?

    1. God does not have the power to answer my prayer
    2. God is uncaring as to my plight
    3. God does not really exist.

    Are there any other scenerios I'm missing? If so, which one? If not, then which do you subscribe?
  4. Subscribersonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    slatington, pa, usa
    Joined
    28 Dec '04
    Moves
    53223
    19 Aug '15 11:181 edit
    Originally posted by whodey
    So you are a Catholic but don't believe God answers prayer?

    What then is your position?

    1. God does not have the power to answer my prayer
    2. God is uncaring as to my plight
    3. God does not really exist.

    Are there any other scenerios I'm missing? If so, which one? If not, then which do you subscribe?
    What about the 100 MILLION people killed in WW2 and other wars in century 20? You think none of those people prayed? What kind of insane uncaring god do you believe in that would allow that many people to die retched deaths at the hands of torturing maniacs?

    100 million people is approximately the entire population of the US in 1940 or so. A few percent of ALL humanity.

    So I can say with certainty, 200 million deaths would be ignored, 2 BILLION deaths would have been ignored.

    We didn't make up those numbers, 100 million actually died and most of them tortured or fed to gas chambers, infants, toddlers, teenagers, adults. Pol Pot counted for millions all on his own. Not a word from your god. So Pol Pot could have just as easily killed 100 million by himself and still no word from your god.

    What does it take for people to wake up and realize there will be no god come down to fix our boo boo's? No matter HOW many die.
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