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    07 Feb '11 00:19
    What Can the Diet of Gorillas Tell Us About a Healthy Diet for Humans?
    Health Topics - Traditional Diets
    Monday, February 16 2004 20:27
    One of the arguments proffered by vegetarians is that our primate ancestors were vegetarians and, to be healthy, we should eat the same kind of diet.

    An article entitled "The Western Lowland Gorilla Diet Has Implications For the Health of Humans and Other Hominids," which appeared in a recent issue of Human and Clinical Nutrition, makes this argument. With reference to the authors' study of the vegetarian diet of gorillas, the research is sound, but to claim that humans would be better off with a vegetarian diet like that of the gorillas is spurious and equivocal.

    One misconception about the gorilla diet is that it contains no animal products. On the contrary, all of the great ape groups take in some animal protein, whether overtly or inadvertently, by consuming insects, insect eggs and the larvae that nest on the plants and fruits they eat. In her pioneering work on chimpanzees, Jane Goodall discovered to her amazement, and to the amazement of the rest of the world, that chimpanzees kill and eat monkeys and make a tool to extract termites from their hills (homes), and that they went to considerable effort to obtain these foods. It is also significant that meat is the only food they share with other chimpanzees.

    All monkeys, lemurs and apes are classified as vegetarians and/or fruitivors, but they consume a small amount of animal protein by unconsciously eating the small insects, their eggs and larvae on the plant foods they select to eat. The National Zoo in Washington, D.C. tried to breed the near extinct fruitivorian South American golden marmoset in captivity with no result, but when a little animal protein was added to their diet, they began to breed, which proves that they require a small amount of animal protein to be healthy and reproduce.

    With the exception of humans, the native habitat of all the primates is in the tropics. By contrast, for thousands of years, humans have inhabited all the land masses of the world, except for Anarctica. The first humans, the Australopithicines, circa 2 million years ago, were omnivorous. Recently, some researchers, in examining their fossil teeth, have claimed that the Australopithicines were vegetarians; but the evidence indicates they were omnivorous. It is clear that by the time "humans" evolved, from Homo erectus through to what is now considered "modern" humans, such as Cro-Magnon man, humans were primarily meat eaters. According to J. Brownoski, (The Ascent of Man), it was meat-eating that led to the rise of modern man. Homo erectus invented stone tools for hunting big game which led to the invention of more advanced stone tools by Cro-Magnon to modern humans.

    It was the quest for meat that led Homo sapiens to colonize the world. They followed the herds of animals. When overpopulation caused the animal food supply to dwindle, many moved on, from tropical Africa to North Africa, Asia, Europe, the Americas and Australia. They walked and adapted to the cold climates and were able to do so because meat is compact energy, and one kill of a mammoth or other big game could feed many people and lasted for a long period of time; whereas gathering plants and fruits to eat was seasonal. Until the early part of the 20th century there were peoples who lived almost entirely on animal food. For example, the Eskimos of North America and Lapps of Scandinavia lived almost entirely on animal protein and were very healthy.

    However, when we refer to meat, remember that meat entails fats which are necessary for sound health. The protein and minerals in the meat cannot be utilized without the nutrients in the fat. Both Steffanson and Brody, who spent time with the Eskimos and Indians of North America, reported that these people saved the fat from game animals and always ate their meat with fat.

    The Eskimos ate raw meat, which is very healthy, but there is a caveat for modern society: fresh meat often contains bacteria and parasites that can cause illness, and even death, therefore it is recommended by the government that all meat should be cooked well enough to kill all such pollutants.

    Humans only turned to plant foods as major food sources when, due to the ever-increasing human population, herds of animals became scarce. They learned to domesticate some animals and invented agriculture.

    Humans learned to use fire, to any extent, in the Paleolithic age. Cooking certainly was necessary, because grains cannot be eaten raw. It is also interesting to note that when humans began eating a diet high in grains, the incidence of tooth decay increased considerably. Tooth decay increased dramatically when refined grains (wheat and rice) became staple diets for a large percentage of the world's population.

    For normal growth and sound health throughout life, the human species requires eight amino acids which their bodies cannot manufacture, vitamin B12 and some essential minerals. The only viable source of these amino acids and of vitamin B12 is animal protein such as red meat, fish, shell fish, eggs, milk, insects and worms. The lack of these amino acids results in serious illnesses. For example, kwashiorkor is a deficiency disease which impedes the normal development of vital brain cells and stunts growth. People may be getting all they need to eat to satisfy their hunger from grains and other plant foods. They may even become plump on a diet of grains, but their normal growth and development is stunted. For instance, some Maya Indian peasant groups of Guatemala primarily have only corn, beans and squash to eat. They like meat, but are too poor to purchase meats or raise animals. Feeding domesticated animals would sacrifice land needed to grow the grains on which they subsist. This condition is common over much of the world.

    Unlike humans, the digestive tract of gorillas is equipped to manufacture the essential amino acids and other vital nutrients. The human digestive system is not so equipped and we must rely on animal proteins.

    It is interesting to note that advocates of vegetarian diets who use the diet of apes as a rational to support their food choice--asserting that the ape diet is more "natural"--fail to advocate eating a diet of all-raw plant foods as the apes do. The basic plant foods that humans eat must be cooked. Vegan advocates also say that by combining grains with legumes, one can get the essential amino acids. Though this may be theoretically possible, in practice it is not viable and extremely difficult or impossible to accomplish, particularly if robust health is to be achieved and maintained generation after generation. Of course, due to modern technology, many of the essential nutrients can be supplied by synthetic or processed products, but these merely duplicate what is naturally in animal protein and are often extracted from them. To be on the safe side, it is wise to procure essential nutrients from their best source--animal protein.

    Anthropologists have wondered why certain foods came to be prohibited by some religions. The anthropologist, Dr. Marvin Harris, in his two extremely readable, informative and enjoyable books, Cannibals and Kings and Cows, Pigs, Wars and Witches, shows that the prohibition of pigs (pork) by the Jewish religion and cows by the Hindu religion came about due to the ever-increasing pressure of population growth.

    Pigs eat grain. It takes lots of land to grow grain for wheat which could feed more humans than it could feed pigs that require the grain to become meat on the human dinner-table. So wheat was in competition with pigs and the wheat won out when human referees decided wheat was more efficient in feeding the growing population. So pork wasn't worth the grain and was prohibited by the religious leaders as a strategy to feed the population more efficiently.

    Likewise, in India where beef was widely eaten at an earlier time in history, the Hindu religion prohibited it because the cow was more valuable for its milk and dung than as edible beef. Milk from the cow provided animal protein and the dung provided fuel for the fires to cook food. Religious sanctions are a very powerful societal force of control. (In these books by Harris, only a few pages are devoted to this subject, but the books are highly recommended for gaining insight into human behavior.)

    In economically diverse societies where animal protein is scarce among the poorer classes and more abundant in the increasingly affluent sectors of society, it is interesting to note the differences in body height that seems to reflect the way people are forced to eat. The less affluent sectors subsist primarily on grains and a few vegetables and lack the height that is found among the more affluent ruling classes. This situation can develop as a result of overpopulation because too many humans inhabiting in a region can deplete the carrying capacity of the land upon which the food is produced.

    The ancient Maya of the Classical Period used the slash and burn strategy to create more arable land as their population outgrew the surrounding forest. In order to create fields in which to grow corn, squash, beans and chili peppers, forest land was cleared by the destructive method of cutting down trees and burning the debris. This is a very brutal strategy within a fragile ecosystem that rapidly exhausts the soil. The Mayan diet consisted chiefly of the vegetables they grew, a few fruits and game. But the game became scarce as the forest was cleared for farm land and only the tiny ruling class had access to animal protein. (They had the domestic turkey and dog, but these animals ate the same food as humans.) This ecologically unstable situation led to the collapse of the Classical Maya civilization when they abandoned their great cities. The point for this article is t...
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    07 Feb '11 00:22
    The point for this article is that the skeletons unearthed from the Mayan burial grounds reveal that the ruling class was taller than the masses. The nobility supplemented their basic diet of corn, beans and squash with what animal protein was available; whereas the masses had practically none.

    So what can the diet of gorillas tell us about what constitutes a healthy diet for humans? Little if anything. Humans are omnivores and need animal protein as well as plant foods to maintain sound health. The author of this article and Dr. Melvin E. Page recommend, as presented in their book, Your Body is Your Best Doctor, the following as a sound diet to help maintain optimal health: Eat a variety of fresh animal protein and fats, a wide variety of fresh vegetables, fruits and nuts and whole grain breads and cereals.

    For a complete bibliography on this subject, see "The Relevance of Paleolithic Diet in Determining Contemporary Nutritional Needs," H. Leon Abrams, Jr. The Journal of Applied Nutrition. Vol. 31, Numbers 1 and 2.

    Editor's Note: Many practitioners still recommend the use of raw meat for its health-building properties, pointing out the careful handling and protective factors in the diet can minimize the risks of parasite and microbial infection.



    This article appeared in Wise Traditions in Food, Farming and the Healing Arts, the quarterly magazine of the Weston A. Price Foundation, Summer 2000.

    About the Author


    H. Leon Abrams, Jr., MA, EDS is Associate Professor Emeritus of Anthropology E.G.C., University System of Georgia. His areas of specialization in anthropology are Mesoamerica and nutritional anthropology. He has written seven books and 170 articles and reviews. He is an honorary board member of the Weston A. Price Foundation.
  3. Standard memberDasa
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    07 Feb '11 00:54
    Originally posted by josephw
    The point for this article is that the skeletons unearthed from the Mayan burial grounds reveal that the ruling class was taller than the masses. The nobility supplemented their basic diet of corn, beans and squash with what animal protein was available; whereas the masses had practically none.

    So what can the diet of gorillas tell us about what constitut ...[text shortened]... d 170 articles and reviews. He is an honorary board member of the Weston A. Price Foundation.
    Firstly propaganda from persons with a vested interest in supporting meat sales is unreliable at best.


    101 Reasons to go Vegetarian
    No Copyright and anonymous author
    This is the definitive list of reasons to become vegetarian — everything from cruelty and health to ecology and world hunger.

    PEOPLE

    Every year in the UK we feed our livestock enough food to feed 250,000,000 people while in the world 30,000,000 people die of starvation
    20 vegetarians can live off the land required by one meat eater
    Every 3 seconds a child dies of starvation somewhere in the world
    If Americans reduced their meat consumption by 10% it would free 12,000,000 tons of grain—enough to feed 60,000,000 people (the population of Great Britain)
    If all Americans became vegetarian, it would free enough grain to feed 600,000,000 people (the population of India)
    Intensification in animal farming has displaced 1,000,000's of people from their traditional lands—eg. indigenous people in south & central america, native americans in north america & crofters in Great Britain — this is continuing today
    People displaced from their lands into cities succumb to dietary deficiency, diseases, parasites & opportunistic diseases
    In third world countries 1 in 10 babies die before their first birthday
    The UK imports £46,000,000 worth of grain from third world countries to feed our livestock
    Due to overgrazing 850,000,000 people live on land threatened by desertification & over 230,000,000 already live on land so severely desertified that they are unable to sustain their existence & face imminent starvation
    1,000,000,000 people in the west gorging on meat & dairy leave 1,000,000,000 to waste away & 3,500,000,000 teeter on the brink

    LAND

    If they continue to clear American forests to raise cattle at the present rate, in 50 years there will be none left
    1 acre yields 165 lbs of beef or 20,000 lbs of potatoes
    8/10 of cultivated land in the UK is used to grow food for animals (14,732,000 hectares)
    It takes 16lbs of high protein soya to produce 1 lb of beef
    Since 1945 in the UK we have lost 95% of flower meadows, 50% of ancient woodlands, 40% of heathlands, 50% of wet lands & 224,000 km of hedgerows all due to animal farming
    Pressure on land due to meat farming leads to soil erosion 6billion tons/year in the USA
    If everyone went vegetarian upto 90% of land used for animal farming could be taken out of production & used to replant woodlands, leisure activities etc.
    25% of Central america's forests have been destroyed for cattle grazing since 1960
    Between 1966-1983 38% of the Amazon rain forest was destroyed for cattle grazing
    90% of cattle ranches established on cleared forest land go bankrupt in less than 8 years as the land becomes barren due to nutrient loss & overgrazing
    Overgrazing by cattle is destroying the land & increasing desertification, nearly 430 million acres in the USA alone has suffered a 25-50% reduction in yield since first grazed
    An inch of topsoil takes 200-1000 years to develop—yet in the USA they have lost around 1/3 of their prime topsoil in 200 years (around 7 inches) due to animal farming
    Land will be lost due to rises in sea level due to global warming due to animal farming

    AIR

    The destruction of the rainforest by cattle farmers is destroying the lungs of the planet & reducing the worlds capacity to replenish our oxygen supply
    The 1,300,000,000 cattle in the world emit 60,000,000 tons of methane per year (methane is a greenhouse gas & leads to global warming)
    Burning of forests, grasslands & agricultural waste associated with animal farming releases 50-100,000,000 tons of methane per year
    Combining these figures, 25% of methane emissions are due to animal farming (not including the billions of sheep, pigs & poultry so the real figure is much higher)
    Fertilizer used to grow crops to feed to animals releases nitrous oxide — thought to account for 6% of the greenhouse effect
    Fertilizer, weedkiller & pesticides sprayed on crops enter the atmosphere creating a noxious carcinogenic cocktail
    CFCs are released into the air from refrigeration units used to store decomposing flesh (meat), milk & butter—CFCs are destroy the ozone layer
    Ammonia from animal urine also pollutes the atmosphere
    CO2 is released by burning oil & petrol in lorries, ships, abattoirs, dairies, factories etc. associated with meat & dairy production
    Emissions from large chemical plants which produce fertilizer, weedkiller & other agricultural chemicals are also poisoning our air

    WATER

    25 gallons of water to produce 1lb of wheat & 2500 gallons to produce 1lb of meat
    UK farm animals produce 200,000,000 tonnes of slurry (liquid excrement) every year, the majority of which ends up in our rivers
    Bloody waste water from abattoirs ends up in our rivers
    In the USA every second humans produce 12,000 lbs of effluent while farmed animals produce 250,000 lbs
    Nitrates & pesticides used on crops grown to feed livestock end up in our rivers
    Meat & dairy farming uses 70 litres of water per day per animal in the UK or 159,250,000,000 litres per year in total
    The water used to produce 10 lbs of steak is equivalent to the average consumption of water for an entire household for an entire year
    Depletion of groundwater reserves to grow crops for animals & to supply abattoirs will lead to greater water shortages
    Aquafers (stores of underground water) in the San Joaquin valley in the USA are being drained at the rate of 500,000,000,000 gallons/year to produce meat
    18% of all agricultural land in the world is irrigated & as global warming increases (partly due to animal farming) it will cost $200,000,000 to keep these systems going
    The water used to produce a 1000 lb beef steer is enough to float a Destroyer battleship
    The liquid waste from the various parts of the meat & dairy industry flow into the rivers & from there into the seas polluting them & encouraging huge algal blooms to grow

    EFFICIENCY

    To produce 1calorie of energy from meat takes 60 calories of petrol, whereas growing grains & legumes to directly feed people produces 20 calories for each calorie of fuel used ( thats 1200 times more efficient)
    Meat & dairy farming uses billions of gallons of oil to run tractors, fuel ships & lorries (to move animal feed & animals), pump billions of gallons of water to irrigate fields & run slaughterhouses, power refrigeration units to prevent the corpses from decomposing & to power sewage plants to clean up some of the pollution produced
    Cattle convert only 6% of their energy intake (mainly grains & soya) into flesh, the remaining 94% is wasted as heat, movement (which is why they keep many animals in very close confinement), hair, bones, faeces etc
    1lb of beef takes 1 gallon of petrol to produce
    A family of four eating beef for a year uses enough petrol to run a car for 6 months (obviously depending on how far you drive!)
    If the full ecological cost of meat was passed onto the consumer—the price would be quadrupled (at least)
    The EC spends o100,000,000's to subsidise animal production resulting in lakes of unwanted milk & mountains of unwanted meat & butter. This money could be better spent encouraging organic fruit, vegetable & grain production
    In the USA in 1979 145,000,000 tons of crops were fed to cattle resulting in only 21million tons of animal bodies—the cost of the wasted crops was $20,000,000,000
    Between 1950 & 1985 grain production in Europe & the USA increased massively but 2/3 was fed to animals
    70% of all grain is fed to animals
    Eating vast quantities of animal flesh, eggs, milk & butter is a luxury that most of the planet can not afford

    ANIMALS

    Fishing with drift (and other modern) nets weakens & destroys ecosystems by indiscriminately killing billions of sea creatures & disrupting the sea bed
    Fishermen's nets kill 10 times as many other animals as the fish they are hoping to catch
    Fish caught in nets die an agonising slow death of suffocation
    Each year 15,000,000,000 land animals are slaughtered for food & an unknown but much larger number of sea creatures (including 1000's of dolphins caught accidentally)
    Chickens are crammed into battery cages with upto 3 other birds, they are unable to even spread their wings & many can not even stand up
    Unwanted male chicks (because they can't lay eggs) are gassed or pulped while their sisters go to the battery sheds
    Chicks are debeaked without anaesthetic to prevent them injuring each other in the unnaturally confined conditions they are kept in—this is equivalent to having your fingernails pulled out without anaesthetic
    Modern farming methods using growth hormones & artificial lighting mean that many chickens out grow their bones, resulting in fractured & broken legs
    Sows are kept tethered in stalls 1.3 x 1 metre on concrete or slatted floors—they can not even turn around
    Poultry raised for meat are kept in windowless broiler sheds, with around 20-30,000 in each shed, they live in an area of 10-20 cm square—fighting due to overcrowding is common & like battery hens they commonly suffer from supperating bed sores
    Broilersheds are artificially lit 23 hours a day to produce rapid growth
    Animals travel between farms & to slaughter in overcrowded transporters with no food or water—resulting in stress, injuries & deaths—legal requirements are widely ignored
    95% of poultry suffer injuries before being killed & 30% suffer broken bones
    Problems with stunning practices mean that many animals have their throats slit while still conscious (around 6% of cattle or 200,000 per year) & are then dipped in tanks of scalding water (to loosen feathers, bristles etc.) again while fully conscious
    4000 animals die spurting their blood out every minute in a British slaughterhouse
    Calf leather comes from animals killed at just 2 weeks old
    Cows were fed on the ground up remains of other cows & sheep—the result is thought to be BSE (mad cow disease) in the ...
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    07 Feb '11 01:55
    Originally posted by vishvahetu
    Firstly propaganda from persons with a vested interest in supporting meat sales is unreliable at best.


    101 Reasons to go Vegetarian
    No Copyright and anonymous author
    This is the definitive list of reasons to become vegetarian — everything from cruelty and health to ecology and world hunger.

    PEOPLE

    Every year in the UK we feed our livestock e ...[text shortened]... remains of other cows & sheep—the result is thought to be BSE (mad cow disease) in the ...
    Eat meat vishva. It's your only salvation. If you eat some meat you will become enlightened.

    C'mon vishva. Join us meat eaters so more babies will die.
  5. Standard memberDasa
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    07 Feb '11 02:131 edit
    Originally posted by josephw
    Eat meat vishva. It's your only salvation. If you eat some meat you will become enlightened.

    C'mon vishva. Join us meat eaters so more babies will die.
    You are a thoroughly dishonest person, and not because you believe falsity.........but because you refuse to reject falsity.

    You know in your heart what is false but you subscribe to it anyway.......because to reject the error, would instantly make your Bible false.

    So you embrace falsity, to protect the error in the Bible.

    How can you possibly advance in spiritual life if you do this?

    All the blood in China, will not atone for your belief in error and your teaching of error.

    Become honest immediately, by rejecting the error and embrace the truth as presented by Vedanta.
  6. SubscriberFMF
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    07 Feb '11 02:19
    Originally posted by vishvahetu
    You are a thoroughly dishonest person, and not because you believe falsity.........but because you refuse to reject falsity.

    You know in your heart what is false but you subscribe to it anyway...
    Why don't you just stop accusing people of being liars, vishvahetu?
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    07 Feb '11 02:47
    Originally posted by vishvahetu
    You are a thoroughly dishonest person, and not because you believe falsity.........but because you refuse to reject falsity.

    You know in your heart what is false but you subscribe to it anyway.......because to reject the error, would instantly make your Bible false.

    So you embrace falsity, to protect the error in the Bible.

    How can you possibly a ...[text shortened]... Become honest immediately, by rejecting the error and embrace the truth as presented by Vedanta.
    "Become honest immediately, by rejecting the error and embrace the truth as presented by Vedanta."

    To be honest, if I had a copy of the Vedanta on me right now I'd pour gas on it and set it on fire.

    Is that honest enough for you?

    The lack of animal protein in your diet is effecting the way you interpret reality.
  8. Standard memberDasa
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    07 Feb '11 03:051 edit
    Originally posted by josephw
    [b]"Become honest immediately, by rejecting the error and embrace the truth as presented by Vedanta."

    To be honest, if I had a copy of the Vedanta on me right now I'd pour gas on it and set it on fire.

    Is that honest enough for you?

    The lack of animal protein in your diet is effecting the way you interpret reality.[/b]
    You are angry because you have been exposed as a fraud.

    If you were an honest gentleman you would reject error....but of course that would make the Bible wrong, so you embrace error and teach error, and therefore your spiritual life is going backwards.
  9. Standard memberkaroly aczel
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    07 Feb '11 04:22
    Originally posted by FMF
    Why don't you just stop accusing people of being liars, vishvahetu?
    Oh just forget about it, either he is too thick to get it or he thinks that he has the right to consistenly use that word to make his point. Dont get me wrong, I dont like the way he uses it either, but it has been pointed out to him by several posters many times.

    Of course this is just a suggestion, but based on Vishies posting history, I dont think you are going to get much joy in turning his attitude around.
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    07 Feb '11 04:24
    Originally posted by josephw
    What Can the Diet of Gorillas Tell Us About a Healthy Diet for Humans?
    Health Topics - Traditional Diets
    Monday, February 16 2004 20:27
    One of the arguments proffered by vegetarians is that our primate ancestors were vegetarians and, to be healthy, we should eat the same kind of diet.

    An article entitled "The Western Lowland Gorilla Diet Has ...[text shortened]... vilization when they abandoned their great cities. The point for this article is t...
    First, I am a vegetarian and I will admit that I do rely on iron supplements and protein soy isolate to complement the absence of meat. This, however, is because I am active and weight train (requiring about twice the amount of protein of a normal man) and because I regularly donate plasma (part of the interview process requires a hemoglobin count and I need regular iron to maintain a count above 130.) When, however, I did not exercise, I still was very healthy. I could maintain a hemoglobin count at about 140 without a problem. Vegetarians can still be healthy.

    Second, animal beef is not the most efficient source of protein. Obviously lean beef and fish contain all the amino acids and proteins necessary for healthy protein intake and I can concede that legumes and grains do not supply all the necessary amino acids. However egg is in fact the best source of protein and amino acids. It also has a biological value of 100% (meaning all of it can be used by the body) whereas lean beef only has about 91%. Cows milk and soy beans are the next best sources of protein. This is in fact why protein complement powders are usually derived from either egg, whey or soy (whey is extracted from cow's milk). A vegetarian can easily subsist on these and maintain healthy protein levels (which is about one gram per kilogram each day.) In fact, it is healthier because, apart from whey, there is very little saturated fats.
  11. Standard memberkaroly aczel
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    07 Feb '11 04:26
    Originally posted by vishvahetu
    Firstly propaganda from persons with a vested interest in supporting meat sales is unreliable at best.


    101 Reasons to go Vegetarian
    No Copyright and anonymous author
    This is the definitive list of reasons to become vegetarian — everything from cruelty and health to ecology and world hunger.

    PEOPLE

    Every year in the UK we feed our livestock e ...[text shortened]... remains of other cows & sheep—the result is thought to be BSE (mad cow disease) in the ...
    Good post, rec'd

    And no mention of the vedanta.
    Common sense is prolly a better way forward for you, you have already repeatedly told us you get your truth from the Vedanta, perhaps by referring to the common sense from the Vedas in your own words, you may have better luck in trying to highlight the problems of meat eating.
  12. Standard memberkaroly aczel
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    07 Feb '11 04:35
    Originally posted by Conrau K
    First, I am a vegetarian and I will admit that I do rely on iron supplements and protein soy isolate to complement the absence of meat. This, however, is because I am active and weight train (requiring about twice the amount of protein of a normal man) and because I regularly donate plasma (part of the interview process requires a hemoglobin count and I nee ...[text shortened]... h day.) In fact, it is healthier because, apart from whey, there is very little saturated fats.
    My first girlfriend of 5 years studied nutrition at a uni in melbourne for three years, though she was not a vegetarian, she could see many problems with eating meat.

    Iron is about the only thing that is hard to get enough of with a vegetarian diet.
    All other minerals and vitamins can be easily supplemented with a vegetarian diet.
    According to her anyway, and like I said, she was just presenting what she had learnt in her studies, she was not promoting a vegetarian diet in any way. She loved her steak. She was just presenting the facts that she had learnt, so I put more weight on her words about the necessary nutrititon humans need to stay healthy, because she had not underlying agenda.

    also , if you do eat meat, then try to get a glass chopping board, its the most sterile way to go.
  13. Standard memberDasa
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    07 Feb '11 09:43
    Originally posted by Conrau K
    First, I am a vegetarian and I will admit that I do rely on iron supplements and protein soy isolate to complement the absence of meat. This, however, is because I am active and weight train (requiring about twice the amount of protein of a normal man) and because I regularly donate plasma (part of the interview process requires a hemoglobin count and I nee ...[text shortened]... h day.) In fact, it is healthier because, apart from whey, there is very little saturated fats.
    Hi....

    Chick peas are high in protean and if you boil them, drain them and spice them with say ( hing, cumin, coriander etc.) and leave in the fridge for snacking.

    And their cheap.

    Ten chick peas will supply all your protein for the day.
  14. Lowlands paradise
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    07 Feb '11 10:36
    If we can live without eating meat, great. Our world cannot support 700.000.000 regular meat eaters. But there are situations and regions where you have to eat meat if you want to stay healthy.
    In Mongolia all they posses is cattle. The cattle is their food, housing, transport, fuel. They live with their animals, they love their animals and they kill them - when needed - with compassion.
  15. SubscriberProper Knob
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    07 Feb '11 10:55
    Originally posted by vishvahetu
    Hi....

    Chick peas are high in protean and if you boil them, drain them and spice them with say ( hing, cumin, coriander etc.) and leave in the fridge for snacking.

    And their cheap.

    Ten chick peas will supply all your protein for the day.
    Chick peas are high in protean..........Ten chick peas will supply all your protein for the day.

    Utter nonsense. Chick peas are around 7g of protein per 100g, that's not high. A tin of tuna is around 35g of protein per 100g.

    Ten chick peas? You need to do some reading.
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