26 Mar '15 13:08>
Originally posted by wolfgang59http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lungfish
As if anyone believes a fish with lungs!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bichir
Originally posted by RBHILLIf you want to know how much merit any given explanation has (for anything), you begin by looking at the logic of it. If it's not even logically consistent you can dismiss it right there and then. If it passes the logic test, you take a look at the assumptions made in the explanation. How many assumptions are made, and how much support do we have for making those assumptions? If the assumptions turn out to be wrong, you can usually dismiss the explanation given. If there are unsupported assumptions you withhold judgement until you can check those assumptions. If the assumptions are reasonabΕe, given what we already know about the world, you look at the evidence for this specific explanation. At this point it should be easy to interpret the evidence to figure out if they support or contradict the explanation. All this you may file under the category of critical thinking.
How about this if you think that the Bible is written by flawed man how can you trust any other books ever written? Or even any other idea?
Why are there millions of diet books? Why haven't they figured it out? One book is all you needed why have the other 999,999 health books?
Originally posted by C HessI am not mad at Potholer. I was only pointing out his illogic. But I am happy to see one evolutinists admit that gills never turned into lungs. π
Don't be mad at potholer. It is Hovind who says that two groups of non-interbreeding animals are still the same kind if they share common ancestry, and that common ancestry is determined by what isn't a banana.
Incidently, there's a good fossil record demonstrating that whale ancestors (not modern whales, nor bananas) had legs. If you want to close your ey ...[text shortened]... . Lungs evolved into the swimbladder in modern fish.
Your post is just more creationist crap.
Originally posted by RJHindsSince you bestow anyone who's not a creationist with the title evolutionist, that statement means nothing. You could have been talking to the "evolutionist" equivalent of yourself, for all I know. What matters is what evolutionary science has to say about how different organs have evolved.
It has been a long time, so I don't remember who I heard it from now, but I believe it was an evolutionist.
Originally posted by C HessGetting back to the thread idea, Kent Hovind has always agreed that one could call changes within kinds during reproduction "evolution" even though he prefers the term "variation" instead. However, he has never agreed that all kinds have evolved from one common ancestor as the theory of evolution supposes.
Since you bestow anyone who's not a creationist with the title evolutionist, that statement means nothing. You could have been talking to the "evolutionist" equivalent of yourself, for all I know. What matters is what evolutionary science has to say about how different organs have evolved.
Originally posted by RJHindsIt is illogical of Hovind to say:
Getting back to the thread idea, Kent Hovind has always agreed that one could call changes within kinds during reproduction "evolution" even though he prefers the term "variation" instead. However, he has never agreed that all kinds have evolved from one common ancestor as the theory of evolution supposes.
So it is dishonest of Potholer to pretend to use ...[text shortened]... tempt to convince others that Hovind now accepts evolution in the same sense that Potholer does.
Originally posted by C HessThere is nothing wrong with premise 1 and 2. Those are correct.
It is illogical of Hovind to say:
1. Things bring forth after their own kind, if they can produce offspring, they're the same kind
2. Variation through natural selection is possible, and may lead to groups of the same kind not being able to interbreed
That's like saying, things bring forth after their own kind, or not.
3. We know that groups are sti ...[text shortened]... an hardly accuse potholer of dishonesty for merely pointing out the flaws in Hovind's reasoning.
Originally posted by RJHindsThe second statement contradicts the first. To say something is and is not, is to say nothing of value. It's illogical.
There is nothing wrong with premise 1 and 2. Those are correct.
However, premise 3 and 4 is invalid logic and a misrepresentation of the example given by Hovind. Anyone with common sense should know Hovind was not including everything in existence, except a banana, as being the same kind.
Yes, I accuse Potholer of being, not only dishonest, but also, a liar. π
Originally posted by C HessThe second premise does not contradicts the first. They are just two seperate premises. The first premise is pointing out the fact that if they can reproduce, then they are the same kind. The second premise is not saying that not being able to reproduce automatically means they are not the same kind as you seem to think.
The second statement contradicts the first. To say something is and is not, is to say nothing of value. It's illogical.
As for 3 and 4, Hovind argued that it's so easy to classify a kind that even a five year old can do it, and then used the banana to allow a six year old to do the classification. He should have realised where that logic would lead. The fa ...[text shortened]... u can see that too by now, but you can't back down. I'll make it easy for you.
{walking away}