For Kelly.

Originally posted by FMF
The banter goes both ways. You yourself are pretty unrelenting don't you think?

When it's necessary. When confronted by people who believe my beliefs are ridiculous and nonsensical.

Originally posted by Suzianne
When it's necessary. When confronted by people who believe my beliefs are ridiculous and nonsensical.

So it's OK when you vilify people, is that what you mean? 😀

Originally posted by Suzianne
Just as I do not recall any atheists here ever criticizing any atheists for calling Christian beliefs ridiculous or nonsensical. If anything, they always agree.

So you think it's OK for people to call each others beliefs ridiculous or nonsensical, is that what you mean? 😀

Originally posted by Proper Knob

Sorry Proper Knob. I have contributed to your thread losing its rudder for its first page as Suzianne seemed to want to air her feelings of being persecuted rather than participate in an examination of KellyJay's ideology. I apologise.

Here is your OP again here on page two:

So this doesn't get lost in the mix, and also because you don't seem to have answered my questions (even though you said you would) which i asked a few days ago now.

'You have no clue how a Christian have Christ in their life!'

Can you elaborate on this, and also explain the 'reality' and your 'relationship' with Jesus.

Originally posted by josephw
Personally, I don't feel persecuted here in this forum, or anywhere else for that matter, but don't you think the Christians posting in this forum take it on the cheek often enough?

It's one thing to have the things one says criticized, and another to have one's person vilified, much less the person of the Lord Jesus Christ.

What was that that Jesus said? "Every word..."

Do you not think that there are some ethnic and religious groups whose ideology is informed by their having been persecuted? I, for one, admit to thinking there is at least one such ethno-religious group for whom persecution (actual persecution has occurred to them, I agree) has become fundamental to their faith, and therefore the belief that it has ended will never come to them, or it will be retained only by their more zealous adherents.

Not Suzianne, of course.

Originally posted by JS357
Do you not think that there are some ethnic and religious groups whose ideology is informed by their having been persecuted?

Looking back I realize that me and my family - when I was a kid - were discriminated against to a degree and perceived in a certain [derogatory] way that I did not fully understand at the time ~ I came to understand the ideologies that underpinned the prejudice later. It was mild and inconsequential compared to what my parents faced when they were young. In their case, however, I don't think it resulted in their ideology being accentuated (or informed, as you put it) in any significant way.

Originally posted by Proper Knob
So this doesn't get lost in the mix, and also because you don't seem to have answered my questions (even though you said you would) which i asked a few days ago now.

'You have no clue how a Christian have Christ in their life!'

Can you elaborate on this, and also explain the 'reality' and your 'relationship' with Jesus.

I am sort of amazed many of the Christians here didn’t speak up about this, because I don’t think having God in your life is unique at all. The whole point of Christianity is our walk with God being restored, if it were anything less, than it would be just one of many belief systems completely undistinguishable from all the other flavors of the month. Christianity is what takes place when we accept God’s gift to us, it isn’t something we can earn it isn’t something we can work for it is all on God.

For me I was not raised a Christian, if there were Christians in my life they were well hidden! I think I was in grade school when my parents sent me to a church a lone with some money. They told me to put it in the basket when they passed it around which I did. When they sang a few songs, they broke up for classes and I left. My parents asked me if I wanted to go back, my reply was no. If you are going to give me money I want to keep it.

My dad drank a lot, my family memories had more fights in them than good ones. Parents ended up getting a divorce, I started doing all kinds of things that were not healthy, and wasn’t exactly to worried about my future or the future of those I partied with. I quit school and joined the Navy during the Vietnam War, and nearly got kicked out and sent to jail due to my lifestyle. I got into a ton of trouble, said one of those, “God if you get me out of this!” prayers I’ll turn my life around. Amazingly some type of legal snafu occurred and I was off the hook. I went to church that next weekend then promptly stopped going and jumped back into my old life. The only difference was I started talking to God after that, before He was nothing to me.

After I got out of the service, I was making great money with no bills, and my life was still an unending partying when I could. Now nothing seemed to satisfy my life, I wanted for nothing, and I knew I was missing something important! It was then I started asking God to be a part of my life, I called a TV show that gave their number for prayer and got a recording. Oh well, then I read a newspaper want ad, that said if you are tired of talking to recordings and want to talk to a true live person about a true live God call. It was a family who felt led to put that into the new paper.

I called the number, met the family and we prayed. It was there in their living room I became a Christian. That moment on my life was changed forever, some of the more destructive things I enjoyed doing before I was saved I didn’t want to stop! I kept doing them except now I wasn’t enjoying them anymore. I did stop, as I drew closer to God, the things that I was doing that were destructive to my life were becoming less appealing and now I cared about my life and others in ways I didn’t before.

I’d say a year after that I started going to church, during that time it was different Bible studies, and prayer meetings in different parts of the town I was living in being led by different people. My life was changed by God, I would not have changed it on my own, I liked a lot of the things I was going that I ended up stopping. I didn’t have a drive to improve my life before then, I was happy in the now even if what I was doing had no future.

I’m not going to get into the daily walk with God, every Christian should have their own testimony. The reality as far as I’m concern is that God is alive and well, and Jesus Christ is still changing lives, saving us from our sins.
Kelly

Originally posted by Suzianne
Just as I do not recall any atheists here ever criticizing any atheists for calling Christian beliefs ridiculous or nonsensical. If anything, they always agree.

You clearly don't read many of my posts.

Originally posted by twhitehead
You clearly don't read many of my posts.

I am not convinced that the actual content of posts Suzianne is replying to has much to do with her efforts at "Kicking ass" as she puts it in her profile. I think it's got more to do with the name of the poster. 😀

Originally posted by twhitehead
I think on average, the atheists are more polite than the theists. If theists seem to be having a harder time of it, maybe its because they are trying to defend an indefensible position?

I think it may just be a matter of perspective. Things may seem lopsided here or there, but across the board globally, I don't think we'll ever really know the whole truth about persecution.

I think the children suffer the most.

Pure Christianity is an indefensible position. This world and Christ don't mix. Remember what Jesus said? My Kingdom is not of this world? The Kingdom of Christ comes from out of this world into the heart of the believer by way of faith. It cannot be defended by the philosophies or psychologies or any other human definitions generated in the mind of man.

Christianity exists in the heart and mind as it is made manifest in the believer by the Word of God and the Spirit.

Originally posted by FMF
But don't you think Suzianne is rather more disposed towards the personal vilification of fellow posters than most of the other regulars here? Take a look at her last month's worth of posts for example. I know it's just the internet and I know she's just having fun [her profile says "I'm back and posting as usual. Kicking ass and taking names"] but is she really justified in trying to vilify Proper Knob with her first post on this thread? 🙂

No one is justified in vilifying another just because of a disagreement. Reveal Hidden Content

When do you think vilification is justified?

Originally posted by josephw
Pure Christianity is an indefensible position.

Then you would be well advised to remember that. Theists come under criticism most often on this forum when they make claims that they cannot defend and don't actually believe themselves, or simply haven't thought through.

Originally posted by JS357
Do you not think that there are some ethnic and religious groups whose ideology is informed by their having been persecuted?

I do. Here we use words, not clubs. I am enjoying the freedom to engage in debate and some heated arguments. I don't get a sense of being persecuted.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Then you would be well advised to remember that. Theists come under criticism most often on this forum when they make claims that they cannot defend and don't actually believe themselves, or simply haven't thought through.

True.

2 Corinthians 5:11
Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

Persuasion may be all I've got to go on. By reason and simple common sense do I seek to persuade. I appeal to the authority of scripture.

Originally posted by josephw
By reason and simple common sense do I seek to persuade.

Yet so many of your posts are devoid of reason and common sense (or at least they appear so to me) - for which you get justifiably criticized.