1. Joined
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    05 May '13 12:02
    apparently god is not responsible for the bad things people do. apparently 'freewill' gives us the freedom to do good or bad things.

    so, if we all have 'freewill' what causes some of us to turn bad and some not? it doesnt seem to be random.
  2. Standard membersonship
    the corrected one.
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    05 May '13 12:131 edit
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    apparently god is not responsible for the bad things people do. apparently 'freewill' gives us the freedom to do good or bad things.

    so, if we all have 'freewill' what causes some of us to turn bad and some not? it doesnt seem to be random.
    Define "responsible".
    Define "bad".
    Define "things".
    Define "us"
    Define "freedom" just for starters.

    And by the time you do all that I'm sure we can get you sidetracked off arguing so many issues your original post will evaporate under obfuscation.
  3. Joined
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    05 May '13 12:20
    Originally posted by sonship
    Define "responsible".
    Define "bad".
    Define "things".
    Define "us"
    Define "freedom" just for starters.

    And by the time you do all that I'm sure we can get you sidetracked off arguing so many issues your original post will evaporate under obfuscation.
    responsible,
    to have control and authority over something or someone and the duty of taking care of it or them

    bad,
    unpleasant and causing difficulties or harm

    things,
    a particular set of objects

    us,
    used as the object of a verb or a preposition to refer to a group that includes the speaker and at least one other person

    freedom,
    the condition or right of being able or allowed to do, say, think, etc. whatever you want to, without being controlled or limited

    arse-hole
    an unpleasant or stupid person
  4. Joined
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    05 May '13 13:33
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    apparently god is not responsible for the bad things people do. apparently 'freewill' gives us the freedom to do good or bad things.

    so, if we all have 'freewill' what causes some of us to turn bad and some not? it doesnt seem to be random.
    The Bible says that "we all have inherited sin from Adam".
    And the Bible also says that "man's inclination from birth is to do bad".
    These are just a couple clues for us start to know where some of our problems come from.

    We all sin to different degrees and cannot stop the type of sin we inherited from happening.
    But many factors can make some commit what we think as worse or more serious sins that would be classified in the bible as "gross sins".
    Sometimes it can be because of the lack of training by parents either by example or lack of teaching young ones with the moral compass the Bible can provide.
    It could be the lack of natural love from the parents and also the type of association that one allows themselves to be involved with both with humans and their intertainment interest.
  5. Joined
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    05 May '13 14:34
    Originally posted by galveston75
    The Bible says that "we all have inherited sin from Adam".
    And the Bible also says that "man's inclination from birth is to do bad".
    These are just a couple clues for us start to know where some of our problems come from.

    We all sin to different degrees and cannot stop the type of sin we inherited from happening.
    But many factors can make some ...[text shortened]... allows themselves to be involved with both with humans and their intertainment interest.
    i was thinking primarily outside of sin. a good example is satan. satan was bad before sin. the only catalyst i am aware of for his fall is god giving him freewill. so freewill gave him choice, why did he choose to be evil and where did his evil characteristics manifest from?
  6. Standard memberRJHinds
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    05 May '13 17:09
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    i was thinking primarily outside of sin. a good example is satan. satan was bad before sin. the only catalyst i am aware of for his fall is god giving him freewill. so freewill gave him choice, why did he choose to be evil and where did his evil characteristics manifest from?
    It came from his own mind due to his desire to be like God at first. But when man was created by God and given dominion over the Earth, Satan became to envy man and desire to replace man and so tempted Eve to sin, which also became a sin for Satan as well. He became to desire to replace God and avoid any punishment from God and thereby do anything he pleased. He was able to convince a third of God's angels to follow him in this endeavor and now there is no turning back.
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    05 May '13 17:25
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    It came from his own mind due to his desire to be like God at first. But when man was created by God and given dominion over the Earth, Satan became to envy man and desire to replace man and so tempted Eve to sin, which also became a sin for Satan as well. He became to desire to replace God and avoid any punishment from God and thereby do anything he pleas ...[text shortened]... nvince a third of God's angels to follow him in this endeavor and now there is no turning back.
    But god knew all this was going to happen before god made everything so all the problems are god's fault!
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    05 May '13 17:52
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    It came from his own mind due to his desire to be like God at first. But when man was created by God and given dominion over the Earth, Satan became to envy man and desire to replace man and so tempted Eve to sin, which also became a sin for Satan as well. He became to desire to replace God and avoid any punishment from God and thereby do anything he pleas ...[text shortened]... nvince a third of God's angels to follow him in this endeavor and now there is no turning back.
    why did it come from his own mind? what was it about his mind that made him become evil?
  9. Standard memberRJHinds
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    05 May '13 18:42
    Originally posted by OdBod
    But god knew all this was going to happen before god made everything so all the problems are god's fault!
    What makes you think you know the mind of God? Do you think you have more knowledge and wisdom than the apostle Paul or the prophets?

    Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!

    “For who has known the mind of the Lord?
    Or who has become His counselor?”


    (Romans 11:33-34 NKJV)
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    05 May '13 18:47
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    What makes you think you know the mind of God? Do you think you have more knowledge and wisdom than the apostle Paul or the prophets?

    [b]Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!

    “For who has known the mind of the Lord?
    Or who has become His counselor?”


    (Romans 11:33-34 NKJV)[/b]
    Hang on ,it is you religious people who are always telling everyone god is all knowing and omnipotent ,make up your mind!!!
  11. Standard memberRJHinds
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    05 May '13 18:521 edit
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    why did it come from his own mind? what was it about his mind that made him become evil?
    The prophet Ezekiel writes the following concerning Lucifer A.K.A. Satan:

    “Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created. Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee. By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee. Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.”

    (Ezekiel 28:13-18)
  12. Standard memberwoodypusher
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    05 May '13 19:07
    'free will', according the the mythologists, is 'choosing' to accept jesus as their 'saviour' with threats of burning in hell forever or going to heaven as a reward.

    Kind of like freely signing over your property to someone who has a gun to your head.

    😵
  13. Subscribersonhouse
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    05 May '13 19:23
    Originally posted by galveston75
    The Bible says that "we all have inherited sin from Adam".
    And the Bible also says that "man's inclination from birth is to do bad".
    These are just a couple clues for us start to know where some of our problems come from.

    We all sin to different degrees and cannot stop the type of sin we inherited from happening.
    But many factors can make some ...[text shortened]... allows themselves to be involved with both with humans and their intertainment interest.
    The bible is flatasss wrong. We do not have 'original sin', that is a total fabrication of the writers who tried to make it sound like they were inspired by some god or other. Kids are born with the ability to do altruistic acts as well as being little brats.

    That 'original sin' concept is one of the most hated concepts in the bible for me.

    It right away causes people to question their very existence, being forced by your religion to think of themselves as flawed which they are not by any means.

    Humans can kill, rape, maim and all that but that is not the basic construct of the human race. 99% of humans do no such thing.

    Original sin is one heinous concept, cleverly designed to capture the hearts of people in order to turn their religion into something else, a political power, which it has succeeded in more than the original writers ever thought possible.

    My fondest wish would be to see a REAL god come down to Earth and rightly condemn ALL these Abrahamic religions and show them for what they are:

    DEATH SEEKERS and controllers.
  14. Standard memberRJHinds
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    05 May '13 19:25
    Originally posted by woodypusher
    'free will', according the the mythologists, is 'choosing' to accept jesus as their 'saviour' with threats of burning in hell forever or going to heaven as a reward.

    Kind of like freely signing over your property to someone who has a gun to your head.

    😵
    Well, okay, if you wish to put it that way. But the question still remains, "What are you going to do?"
  15. Joined
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    05 May '13 19:26
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    The prophet Ezekiel writes the following concerning Lucifer A.K.A. Satan:

    “Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee i ...[text shortened]... g thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.”

    (Ezekiel 28:13-18)
    this doesnt answer anything, it just repeats the fact that he became evil. why did he become evil? why was iniquity found? how did it get there? god said he was originally perfect! so what happened and why?
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