God didn't create you to...

@secondson said
Do you think that "belief and worship" constitutes a requirement to satisfy the purposes of God relative to having a relationship with Him?

You are mistaken if you do.

I am asking you what else - aside from belief and worship - is required in order for a believer to fulfil God's purpose for him or her.

@secondson said
You simply don't understand. You think you do, but you don't, because if you did you wouldn't keep looking for the answer to the question you're posing.

Listen and think in the following terms.

Salvation and eternal life are of God. That means what it says. Not of works, not of obedience, not of performance or rites or rituals or anything a ...[text shortened]... ith, or belief if you will. It's the only thing one can do without doing anything. Think about that!

So you think this hits the nail on the head?

"God created you in order that you believe in him and worship him and if you do, you will have everlasting life".

@rajk999 said
Im sure I already said that Jesus is the judge and only Jesus can know these things. I do not know the man. Neither do I know the sheep and goats of Matt 25. Jesus knows. I have made my points pretty clearly and with supporting references.

Formulating a doctrine around one event or on one sentence is a very foolish thing to do

PS there is no reference in the bible to any Christian entering heaven after death.

PS there is no reference in the bible to any Christian entering heaven after death.
It's clear you have NO idea what you are talking about. You only waste others time here with gibberish. Good day. 🙂

Luke 23:42-43 NKJV - 42 Then he said to Jesus, "Lord, remember me when You come into Your kingdom."
43 And Jesus said to him, "Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise."

@kingdavid403 said
PS there is no reference in the bible to any Christian entering heaven after death.
It's clear you have NO idea what you are talking about. You only waste others time here with gibberish. Good day. 🙂

Luke 23:42-43 NKJV - 42 Then he said to Jesus, "Lord, remember me when You come into Your kingdom."
43 And Jesus said to him, "Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise."

Please show where it says the man is going to heaven.
Thanks.

@rajk999 said
Please show where it says the man is going to heaven.
Thanks.

@rajk999 said
Please show where it says the man is going to heaven.
Thanks.
Jesus said: "Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise."
Sounds like heaven to me. Anyone else?

This man died on the cross with NO good works, NO righteous acts, He died a thief and nothing but a thief; who was saved by faith in Jesus only. Nothing more.
So when you say: Good works and righteous acts are required (absolute) by God to be saved, you clearly are wrong; and, a liar.

@kingdavid403 said
you clearly are wrong; and, a liar.

You need to grow up a little, methinks.

@kingdavid403 said
This man died on the cross with NO good works, NO righteous acts, He died a thief and nothing but a thief; who was saved by faith in Jesus only.

The story surely illustrated that your God figure can "save" whoever he wants but I don't see how it negates the clear instructions in your religious literature to obey Jesus' commandments and to do good works.

Furthermore, just because the man was convicted and put to death for being a thief, it does not mean that he had done "NO good works, NO righteous acts" during his lifetime, as you appear to claim.

This sounds like additional detail that serves your personal ideological purposes that you are trying to attach to the story. You know nothing about that man's life prior to that day, except that he stole something, and you presumably believe that Jesus knew more about him than that.

The Gospel is clear about how good works are required ~ not just because it is the very heart of Jesus' teaching but because faith on its own is explicitly stated as being not enough ~ so I don't see how the story about the man on the cross necessarily contradicts it.

@fmf said
Those here who talk about their belief that God created them often seem to be saying more or less this:"God created you in order that you believe in him and worship him and if you do, you will have everlasting life".At the bare bones level, is there more to God's perceived purpose than that?

KingDavid403,

Do you think your God figure's purpose in creating his followers is that they believe in him, worship him, and follow his commandments, including doing good works and striving to live righteously?

@fmf said
The story surely illustrated that your God figure can "save" whoever he wants but I don't see how it negates the clear instructions in your religious literature to obey Jesus' commandments and to do good works. Furthermore, just because the man was convicted and put to death for being a thief, it does not mean that he had done "NO good works, NO righteous acts", as you claim. Thi ...[text shortened]... ing not enough ~ so I don't see how the story about the man on the cross necessarily contradicts it.

I don't see how it negates the clear instructions in your religious literature to obey Jesus' commandments and to do good works.
I NEVER said this ANYWHERE. I said it is NOT always an absolute requirement to be saved.

Furthermore, just because the man was convicted and put to death for being a thief, it does not mean that he had done "NO good works, NO righteous acts", as you claim.
He clearly NEVER did these things after believing in Christ.

The Gospel is clear about how good works are required ~ not just because it is the very heart of Jesus' teaching but because faith on its own is explicitly stated as being not enough
Good works are faith in God aka Jesus. There is NO FAITH without good works; It is nothing but dead faith.
As stated in the Bible.

@fmf said
You need to grow up a little, methinks.

Me thinks the same of you. Me thinks...

@kingdavid403 said
There is NO FAITH without works. It is nothing but dead faith. As stated in the Bible.

So, in other words, good works are required.

@kingdavid403 said
It's clear you have NO idea what you are talking about. You only waste others time here with gibberish.

I think you need to calm down a little.

@fmf said
So, in other words, good works are required.

If you have true faith, you will have good works; if you live that long. The two cannot be separated.
Faith and good works go hand in hand.
People who say they have faith but do not have good works, their faith is not true and their faith is dead.
However, as the thief on the cross, people who come to God aka Jesus on their death beds are still saved. Even without having done good works.

@fmf said
I think you need to calm down a little.

Look in a mirror.

@kingdavid403 said
I don't see how it negates the clear instructions in your religious literature to obey Jesus' commandments and to do good works.
I NEVER said this ANYWHERE. I said it is NOT always an absolute requirement to be saved.

This sounds like clinging to a straw in a legalistic way. So, obeying Jesus' commandments and doing good works "...is NOT always an absolute requirement to be saved". Indeed it sounds like an ideology pitched to people who want the easiest way possible to [tell themselves they have] everlasting life. If Jesus died for your "sins", don't you have to obey his teachings in return?