1. Standard memberknightmeister
    knightmeister
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    11 Jul '06 18:54
    (music)

    .....alive. God's not dead . No! He is alive! Feel him in my heart, feel him in my soul , feel him in my hands ...feel him all over me!

    This little song is one I have heard sung by kids in Church many times but refers to the idea that God is actually alive and with us in the form of the Holy Spirit.

    The question I have is this. There has been loads written on this forum about the Bible , Heaven and Hell , Free will , etc etc etc. So many subjects covered and yet very little discussion on the one and only thing that makes believing in God remotely possible. Without the Holy Spirit and the realisation that God might actually be something more than a philosophical concept we might as well all go home and do something else (Christians and Atheists alike). So why is it discussed so little?
  2. DonationPawnokeyhole
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    11 Jul '06 19:43
    Belief in God is possible without a belief in the Holy Spirit.

    Ask a Muslim or a Jew.
  3. The sky
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    11 Jul '06 19:52
    "Waiter, there is a dead God in my soup!"
    "He's not dead, he is dreaming."

    (Sorry, couldn't resist.)
  4. DonationPawnokeyhole
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    11 Jul '06 20:03
    Originally posted by Nordlys
    "Waiter, there is a dead God in my soup!"
    "He's not dead, he is dreaming."

    (Sorry, couldn't resist.)
    If God were a soup, would you eat his body or drink it?
  5. Felicific Forest
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    11 Jul '06 20:392 edits
    Originally posted by Pawnokeyhole
    Belief in God is possible without a belief in the Holy Spirit.

    Ask a Muslim or a Jew.
    PawnO: "Ask a Muslim or a Jew"

    Genesis 1
    (Young's Literal Translation)


    1 In the beginning of God's preparing the heavens and the earth --

    2 the earth hath existed waste and void, and darkness [is] on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God fluttering on the face of the waters,

    3 and God saith, `Let light be;' and light is.



    http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=1&chapter=1&version=15
  6. DonationPawnokeyhole
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    11 Jul '06 20:58
    Originally posted by ivanhoe
    PawnO: "Ask a Muslim or a Jew"

    Genesis 1
    (Young's Literal Translation)


    1 In the beginning of God's preparing the heavens and the earth --

    2 the earth hath existed waste and void, and darkness [is] on the face of the deep, and the [b]Spirit of God
    fluttering on the face of the waters,

    3 and God saith, `Let light be;' and light is.



    http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=1&chapter=1&version=15[/b]
    That would be the "Ruach Yahweh", literally, the "breath of God", an animating principle.

    The Holy Spirit, of the special sort Jesus claims to have left behind, is another kettle of fish entirely.
  7. Felicific Forest
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    11 Jul '06 21:18
    Originally posted by Pawnokeyhole
    That would be the "Ruach Yahweh", literally, the "breath of God", an animating principle.

    The Holy Spirit, of the special sort Jesus claims to have left behind, is another kettle of fish entirely.
    The Holy Spirit, of the special sort Jesus claims to have left behind, is another kettle of fish entirely "


    Apart from the fact that Jesus didn't "leave the Holy Spirit behind" .... I have to disagree with you here.
  8. Cosmos
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    11 Jul '06 21:38
    "...feel him in my hands ...feel him all over me!..."

    That would be the priest's member and subsequently expelled fluid.
  9. Melbourne, Australia
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    11 Jul '06 22:41
    Originally posted by knightmeister
    (music)

    .....alive. God's not dead . No! He is alive! Feel him in my heart, feel him in my soul , feel him in my hands ...feel him all over me!

    This little song is one I have heard sung by kids in Church many times but refers to the idea that God is actually alive and with us in the form of the Holy Spirit.

    The question I have is this. There ...[text shortened]... o home and do something else (Christians and Atheists alike). So why is it discussed so little?
    Actually it's come up a fair bit, like most other concepts.
    And like most other concepts it's pretty easily separated into those who believe and those who don't.

    The notion of a holy spirit is no different from any other supernatural concept - that is, it's not able to be proven or disproven.
  10. Standard memberknightmeister
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    14 Jul '06 19:27
    Originally posted by Pawnokeyhole
    That would be the "Ruach Yahweh", literally, the "breath of God", an animating principle.

    The Holy Spirit, of the special sort Jesus claims to have left behind, is another kettle of fish entirely.
    I think you're splitting hairs now. Unless you are suggesting that there are different 'types' of God's Spirit then I think it would be wiser to remember that the "Ruach Yahweh " and the Holy Spirit are one and the same. As in the trinity , God is actually one and his Spirit is equally divine in whatever context you find it.

    I don't know what you mean by "special sort" of Spirit. I don't think there is a "special sort" of Spirit because that would suggest there is a "less special" sort of God's Spirit. So surely it's either God's Spirit (and is therefore special ) or it's not . God is God and if we are in his presence it's always special.
  11. Standard memberknightmeister
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    14 Jul '06 19:34
    Originally posted by amannion
    Actually it's come up a fair bit, like most other concepts.
    And like most other concepts it's pretty easily separated into those who believe and those who don't.

    The notion of a holy spirit is no different from any other supernatural concept - that is, it's not able to be proven or disproven.
    Ahh...but this is the point where concepts stop and experience starts. The Holy Spirit as intended in the Bible is not primarily a "concept" to be believed in or not but the living presence of God himself in and around us. This puts it in an entirely different catagory. Without this experience (not concept) I doubt the early church would ever have got going and we wouldn't even be debating Christianity. The whole point of Christianity is that it's not really supposed to be a belief system (or concept) but a love affair with someone who is much closer to us than we ever dare to imagine. Did you no notice that the children in the song were singing about an experience , not a concept? If it's just a concept then we might as well call the whole thing off.
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    14 Jul '06 21:25
    Isn't the Holy Spirit the part of God that you can feel in you? The bit that compels you to do good and helps steer you away from bad? The bit that makes you different to an animal?

    You ('you' referring to any Christian, or anyone with decent knowledge on the subject who won't mock it) may have to explain this to me... I have only been Christian for a couple of months and am still trying to learn as much as I can about it. I still don't quite get the trinity concept though.
  13. Cosmos
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    15 Jul '06 01:24
    Originally posted by borissa
    Isn't the Holy Spirit the part of God that you can feel in you? The bit that compels you to do good and helps steer you away from bad? The bit that makes you different to an animal?

    You ('you' referring to any Christian, or anyone with decent knowledge on the subject who won't mock it) may have to explain this to me... I have only been Christian for a cou ...[text shortened]... ing to learn as much as I can about it. I still don't quite get the trinity concept though.
    " I still don't quite get the trinity concept though."

    Don't bother trying. The whole thing is a pack of lies.
  14. Joined
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    15 Jul '06 10:131 edit
    Originally posted by borissa
    ...any Christian, or anyone with decent knowledge on the subject who won't mock it...
    'who won't mock it' being the key words there.

    All I want is an honest explanation, there's no need for you to get in the way of that. Live and let live. Believe in what you like, but let others believe too.

    Trust me, when I was atheist I spent sooooo long trying to convert Christians and 'bring them to sense'. Then I realised that faith is far, far stronger than any words you can throw at them, and that once you've found God inside yourself it's impossible not to believe, because you can feel that it's right. So give up.
  15. DonationPawnokeyhole
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    15 Jul '06 10:36
    Originally posted by howardgee
    " I still don't quite get the trinity concept though."

    Don't bother trying. The whole thing is a pack of lies.
    If one cannot truthfully assert an absurdity, can one untruthfully deny one?

    So, in principle, could the Trinity be a pack of lies, if it is absurd?
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