Gods will/Jesus's will.

Originally posted by RJHinds
Let me first correct one point in your post. You said:

[b]First the Holy Spirit is never said to have this "will" as Jehovah
and Jesus are said to have but that's another point.

Maybe you should reread the Holy Bible if you have ever read it in
the first place for there are several places that indicates that
the Holy Spitit has a mind and will. ...[text shortened]... s all these things, distributing to
each one individually as He wills. (1 Corinthians 12:11)[/b]

I think it is you who are incorrect; I take it you are a trinitarian?

Firstly, all through the Bible there is a clear theme about the nature of the God/Godhead and that is one of a singular God (single person/personality - single mind-set) manifested in multiple offices and appearances.

"Hear oh Israel the LORD your God is ONE." That's not ONE with a captical T for trinity.

Secondly, all these manifestions of God are subject to the Father including the 'Spirit'. The term Spirit is interchanged throught the NT with Holy Spirit and Spirit of Christ, sometimes in the same passage of text. They are one and the same.

There is one spirit and one Lord of all; the name of which is "the only name given amoung men by which we shall be saved" - JESUS (God saves).

Originally posted by divegeester
I think it is you who are incorrect; I take it you are a trinitarian?

Firstly, all through the Bible there is a clear theme about the nature of the God/Godhead and that is one of a singular God (single person/personality - single mind-set) manifested in multiple offices and appearances.

[b]"Hear oh Israel the LORD your God is ONE." That's not which is "the only name given amoung men by which we shall be saved" - JESUS (God saves).[/b]

I suppose you are a Oneness Pentecostal. If so that is a wrong
understanding of God. I have no problem with the fact that
Israel's LORD is their God and He is one. But then what do you
do with the Father, who is God, and the Holy Spirit, who is God,
and the Son, who is God. They each have their on mind, will,
and personality, yet each one is called God. Even when God
speaks to His Son, He calls the Son God. Even at the creation
of man, God says, "Let us create man in our image" and then
it says man was created in the image God as male and female.
The Hebrew word for "God" here is plural, meaning at least two,
yet it says He (singular) did the creating. We know from the
New Testament that He is the Son. So the Son must have been
talking to at least one other person called God and that is the
Father. But the Spirit of God is also said to be there at creation.
The Son refers to Him as a another helper, like himself, sent from
the Father at the Son's request. He also calls Him the Spirit of Truth.
This Spirit appeared at the baptism of the Son in the form of a dove
and then again at Pentecost as tongues of fire. God the Father is
the only person of the Godhead that has never appeared to man.
That is why it is also true that no man has seen God at any time,
but the Son has declared Him and if you have seen the Son you
have seen the Father for the Son represents the Father.

Originally posted by RJHinds
I suppose you are a Oneness Pentecostal. If so that is a wrong
understanding of God. I have no problem with the fact that
Israel's LORD is their God and He is one. But then what do you
do with the Father, who is God, and the Holy Spirit, who is God,
and the Son, who is God. They each have their on mind, will,
and personality, yet each one is called ...[text shortened]... and if you have seen the Son you
have seen the Father for the Son represents the Father.

So how does all your human explaination that fit with the Biblical "hear oh Israel the LORD your God is one"?

Originally posted by divegeester
So how does all your human explaination that fit with the Biblical "hear oh Israel the LORD your God is one"?

I don't understand what you are asking.

Originally posted by RJHinds
I don't understand what you are asking.

Oh dear.

In your post above you give your (personal/human) explaination of why you believe in three gods of the Trinity. I accept that this is what you believe, I however do not accept it.

My question to you is: how do you rationalise the personal/human explaination you provided above, with the scripture:

"hear oh Israel, the LORD our God is one" Deut:6:4

?

Originally posted by divegeester
Oh dear.

In your post above you give your (personal/human) explaination of why you believe in three gods of the Trinity. I accept that this is what you believe, I however do not accept it.

My question to you is: how do you rationalise the personal/human explaination you provided above with the scripture:

[b]"hear oh Israel, the LORD our God is one" Deut:6:4

?[/b]

It is 6:30 in the morning here and I have been awake all night.
I am beginning to nod off, for I am having trouble holding my
eyes open. I may have to crash in a moment. But let me first
say I don't believe in three gods. I believe everything that is
written about God in the scriptures and that includes God is one.
I agree with most of the Trinity Doctrine that says, in part,
that God can not be divided into parts but consist of three
persons or personalities, which are the Father, the Son, and
the Holy Spirit and these three share in all the attributes of God.
They are not modes of operation as some explain God. But
is one of the mysteries mentioned in the scriptures that the
Holy Spirit has not fully revealed to man. Good night.

Originally posted by RJHinds
It is 6:30 in the morning here and I have been awake all night.
I am beginning to nod off, for I am having trouble holding my
eyes open. I may have to crash in a moment. But let me first
say I don't believe in three gods. I believe everything that is
written about God in the scriptures and that includes God is one.
I agree with most of the Trinity Do ...[text shortened]... s mentioned in the scriptures that the
Holy Spirit has not fully revealed to man. Good night.

6:30am??????

It's not good night, it's good morning!!

Originally posted by RJHinds
It is 6:30 in the morning here and I have been awake all night.
I am beginning to nod off, for I am having trouble holding my
eyes open. I may have to crash in a moment. But let me first
say I don't believe in three gods. I believe everything that is
written about God in the scriptures and that includes God is one.
I agree with most of the Trinity Do ...[text shortened]... s mentioned in the scriptures that the
Holy Spirit has not fully revealed to man. Good night.

How can God be "three separate personalities" but still be ONE who "cannot be divided"?

You are not saying anything, just contradicting yourself and trying to hold to both views.

The highest truth declared in Scritpure about God, is that he exisits; the next highest truth declared is that he is ONE. After that subsequent evidences or appearances cannot superceed these truths and human explainations about doves in the sky and Jesus praying to his Father do not mean that those first 2 truths are in fact false.

We must buy the truth and sell it not.

Originally posted by RJHinds
It is 6:30 in the morning here and I have been awake all night.
I am beginning to nod off, for I am having trouble holding my
eyes open. I may have to crash in a moment. But let me first
say I don't believe in three gods. I believe everything that is
written about God in the scriptures and that includes God is one.
I agree with most of the Trinity Do ...[text shortened]... s mentioned in the scriptures that the
Holy Spirit has not fully revealed to man. Good night.

Lol. the ole "mystery" card huh?

The only mystery is not seeing the truth in the Bible and the trinity is no where to be found in it.

Galveston, perhaps you think that because you wrote a few questions that I or someone else has not answered yet, this proves some Watchtower case for you. But over the last 18 months (at least) there have been many, many issues which I feel you completely ignored and did not address.

As many points that you have evaded, don't think your few unanswered questions mean much. Besides, I am not going try perpetually to demonstrate your errors. There is too much repetition in that.

Too much of this we have been through before. I only answer you for the sake of new posters.

Originally posted by divegeester
How can God be "three separate personalities" but still be ONE who "cannot be divided"?

You are not saying anything, just contradicting yourself and trying to hold to both views.

The highest truth declared in Scritpure about God, is that he exisits; the next highest truth declared is that he is ONE. After that subsequent evidences or appearances c ...[text shortened]... mean that those first 2 truths are in fact false.

We must buy the truth and sell it not.

The Holy Bible identifies these there personalities as having their own wills
and that they have emotions and the mind of God. They all have qualities
of persons. So the conclusion is there must be three persons in one God.
The Holy Bible states there are mysteries that we do not fully understand,
like the mystery of God and the mystery of Christ. The Trinity of God is
a mystery to everyone, but until we are given more knowledge to
understand this mystery we must except all that the Holy Bible says about
God and Christ and the Holy Spirit.

Originally posted by RJHinds
The Holy Bible identifies these there personalities as having their own wills
and that they have emotions and the mind of God. They all have qualities
of persons. So the conclusion is there must be three persons in one God.
The Holy Bible states there are mysteries that we do not fully understand,
like the mystery of God and the mystery of Christ. The ...[text shortened]... s mystery we must except all that the Holy Bible says about
God and Christ and the Holy Spirit.

You still have no shown any scriptures that says the Holy Spirit is God or that calls it God?

Originally posted by galveston75
You still have no shown any scriptures that says the Holy Spirit is God or that calls it God?

I am sure I did. Perhaps you just did not read it. It might be on
another thread or I posted it in reply to someone else.

Originally posted by jaywill
Galveston, perhaps you think that because you wrote a few questions that I or someone else has not answered yet, this proves some Watchtower case for you. But over the last 18 months (at least) there have been [b]many, many issues which I feel you completely ignored and did not address.

As many points that you have evaded, don't think your few unans ...[text shortened]...
Too much of this we have been through before. I only answer you for the sake of new posters.[/b]

Every body forgets sometimes, but the JWs seem to get amnesia
much too often.

Originally posted by RJHinds
I am sure I did. Perhaps you just did not read it. It might be on
another thread or I posted it in reply to someone else.

I'm sure I didn't miss it as it's kind of an important thought. I'f you can get those to me again I'd appreciate it.