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    08 Aug '08 11:55
    Good and evil do not exist from the perspective of the universe as a whole, but are instead artificial constructs of the human mind based on how things affect our ability to survive as a species.

    What does everyone else think?
  2. Standard memberRajk999
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    08 Aug '08 12:07
    Originally posted by Beltaine
    Good and evil do not exist from the perspective of the universe as a whole, but are instead artificial constructs of the human mind based on how things affect our ability to survive as a species.

    What does everyone else think?
    Since your knowledge of the universe as a whole is skimpy at best, how can you or anyone else on this planet claim to know whether or not good or evil exist there.
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    08 Aug '08 12:12
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    Since your knowledge of the universe as a whole is skimpy at best, how can you or anyone else on this planet claim to know whether or not good or evil exist there.
    Well, I base it on my own definition of good and evil and the lack of evidence to the contrary. Let me ask you this, if the earth and everything on it were destroyed tomorrow by a passing asteroid, would it be a good or bad(evil) thing? Who or what would be left behind to make such a judgement? How can such concepts exist without humans to think about them?
  4. Standard memberRajk999
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    08 Aug '08 12:26
    Originally posted by Beltaine
    Well, I base it on my own definition of good and evil and the lack of evidence to the contrary. Let me ask you this, if the earth and everything on it were destroyed tomorrow by a passing asteroid, would it be a good or bad(evil) thing? Who or what would be left behind to make such a judgement? How can such concepts exist without humans to think about them?
    Well obviously that goes without saying. If humans cease to exist, how can there be anything devised by the human mind?

    But how can you say :

    "..Good and evil do not exist from the perspective of the universe as a whole.."

    Exactly how do you know this?
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    08 Aug '08 16:12
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    Well obviously that goes without saying. If humans cease to exist, how can there be anything devised by the human mind?

    But how can you say :

    "..Good and evil do not exist from the perspective of the universe as a whole.."

    Exactly how do you know this?
    Because the universe doesn't care if humans live or die, or a rock if it gets broken in two. Human beings superimpose their artificial judgements on what happens in the world, when in actual fact nothing ultimately matters. To say that good and evil exist outside of human beings (the universal perspective, given our insignificance) would require rocks to have thoughts and feelings and for them to care about what happened to themselves and other rocks.
  6. Standard memberPalynka
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    08 Aug '08 16:23
    Originally posted by Beltaine
    Because the universe doesn't care if humans live or die, or a rock if it gets broken in two. Human beings superimpose their artificial judgements on what happens in the world, when in actual fact nothing ultimately matters. To say that good and evil exist outside of human beings (the universal perspective, given our insignificance) would require rocks to ha ...[text shortened]... e thoughts and feelings and for them to care about what happened to themselves and other rocks.
    But therein lies the flaw of your reasoning. Since the universe is not a conscious entity then it also follows that it's absence of perspective on good and evil is not a good determinant whether good and evil are purely human constructs.
  7. Standard memberDoctorScribbles
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    08 Aug '08 16:25
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    Since your knowledge of the universe as a whole is skimpy at best, how can you or anyone else on this planet claim to know whether or not good or evil exist there.
    Is God omnipresent?
  8. Standard memberpawnfondler
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    08 Aug '08 16:431 edit
    Originally posted by Beltaine
    Because the universe doesn't care if humans live or die, or a rock if it gets broken in two. Human beings superimpose their artificial judgements on what happens in the world, when in actual fact nothing ultimately matters. To say that good and evil exist outside of human beings (the universal perspective, given our insignificance) would require rocks to ha ...[text shortened]... e thoughts and feelings and for them to care about what happened to themselves and other rocks.
    I don't like the world you live in.
    Edit - Not that I think rocks should have feelings either though. But then theres much more to the universe than rocks and far more cool things to assign human weaknesses to. And I like to think of myself as far more significant than a rock.
  9. Standard memberRajk999
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    08 Aug '08 16:55
    Originally posted by Beltaine
    Because the universe doesn't care if humans live or die, or a rock if it gets broken in two. Human beings superimpose their artificial judgements on what happens in the world, when in actual fact nothing ultimately matters. To say that good and evil exist outside of human beings (the universal perspective, given our insignificance) would require rocks to ha ...[text shortened]... e thoughts and feelings and for them to care about what happened to themselves and other rocks.
    Are you assuming that the universe is composed entirely of rocks? If so why?
  10. Standard memberRajk999
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    08 Aug '08 16:59
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    Is God omnipresent?
    The Bible is not clear about the omnipresence of God. It does imply that God is capable of being present in several apects of His creation and in Christ and even in us... etc. But complete omnipresence would mean being present in ALL things at all times. So the question becomes : is He present in the devil? or hell? etc. So my answer is that I do not know.
  11. Subscriberduecer
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    08 Aug '08 17:10
    Originally posted by Beltaine
    Because the universe doesn't care if humans live or die, or a rock if it gets broken in two. Human beings superimpose their artificial judgements on what happens in the world, when in actual fact nothing ultimately matters. To say that good and evil exist outside of human beings (the universal perspective, given our insignificance) would require rocks to ha ...[text shortened]... e thoughts and feelings and for them to care about what happened to themselves and other rocks.
    can you prove that the universe doesn't care?
  12. Standard memberpawnfondler
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    08 Aug '08 17:18
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    The Bible is not clear about the omnipresence of God. It does imply that God is capable of being present in several apects of His creation and in Christ and even in us... etc. But complete omnipresence would mean being present in ALL things at all times. So the question becomes : is He present in the devil? or hell? etc. So my answer is that I do not know.
    im more worried about him being present in a guy who defines the universe as significant rocks.
  13. Standard memberRajk999
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    08 Aug '08 17:32
    Originally posted by pawnfondler
    im more worried about him being present in a guy who defines the universe as significant rocks.
    🙂
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    08 Aug '08 17:45
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    Are you assuming that the universe is composed entirely of rocks? If so why?
    No I'm not - I merely used rocks to make a simple point. Let's not get hung up on rocks. ;o)
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    08 Aug '08 17:47
    Originally posted by duecer
    can you prove that the universe doesn't care?
    No I can't, just as I can't prove that a stone has feelings, but I know which answer I'd put my money on.
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